Episodes

Week 1 - Industry Trends & Insights

Each first Wednesday of the month, we dive into the latest trends, market analysis, and predictions in the outdoor hospitality industry. Join industry analysts, market researchers, and outdoor hospitality industry leaders as they unpack topics like market growth, demographic changes, and guest preferences.

October 7, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – October 7th, 2026

During the October 7, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry leaders emphasized that to attract an evolving, experiential demographic, campground operators must hyper-focus on specific niches, adapt to the rise of smaller, rugged RVs, and forge strong cross-sector collaborations.
September 2, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 2nd, 2026

During the September 2, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, outdoor hospitality experts explored the rapid evolution of AI-integrated property management systems and evolving consumer behaviors, emphasizing a market shift toward simpler recreational vehicles and the importance of targeting guests by specific life stages rather than broad generational labels.
August 5, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – August 5th, 2026

In the August 5th episode of MC Fireside Chats, a diverse panel of outdoor hospitality leaders discussed how current economic headwinds are driving a shift from transient RV travel to long-term stays and unique glamping experiences, emphasizing that operators must leverage creative marketing and exceptional, personalized hospitality to thrive in a rapidly changing market.
July 1, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 1st, 2026

In the July 1, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts discussed how macroeconomic factors and shifting generational preferences are pushing the outdoor hospitality sector to prioritize transparent marketing, proactive AI reputation management, and the creation of highly customized, premium “boutique” RV sites.
June 3, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – June 3rd, 2026

In the June 3, 2026 episode of MC Fireside Chats, our panel of industry experts contrasted the current slowdown in traditional RV sales with the rapid, institutional growth of the glamping sector. The discussion also highlighted how American developers can learn from cost-effective European campsite models and stressed the urgent need to prepare campground electrical grids for the incoming wave of all-electric RVs.
May 6, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – May 6th, 2026

In this episode, guest host Scott Bahr and a panel of industry leaders discussed how rising fuel costs and economic pressures are causing campers to favor shorter, more localized trips and “onboarding” through more accessible accommodations. The group emphasized that the industry’s long-term success depends on a shared responsibility to simplify the guest experience and provide flexible, affordable vacation options for a new generation of casual participants.
April 1, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 1st, 2026

The April 1st, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats featured industry experts Phil Ingrassia, Scott Bahr, and Simon Neal discussing how steady consumer sentiment and the therapeutic nature of the outdoors are sustaining the industry despite rising gas prices and geopolitical tensions. The panel explored the resilience of RVers and the potential for American campgrounds to adopt European-style “all-inclusive” resort models to attract a more diverse range of guests.
March 4, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – March 4th, 2026

Industry experts on MC Fireside Chats analyzed 2026 data trends, highlighting a shift toward shorter booking windows and the untapped potential of dynamic pricing to stabilize revenue despite “mild” transient growth. The panel emphasized that maintaining operational excellence and clear digital communication is essential for navigating current economic fluctuations and ensuring long-term resilience in the outdoor hospitality sector
February 4, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – February 4th, 2026

In the recent episode of MC Fireside Chats aired on February 4th, 2026, host Brian Searl and a panel of experts analyzed the shifting landscape of outdoor hospitality, noting a positive uptick in early-season booking pace and a stronger consumer sentiment compared to previous years. The discussion centered on a comprehensive new report regarding Gen Z, identifying them as a risk-averse, “experience-chasing” demographic that requires highly authentic digital storytelling and multi-channel marketing to engage effectively.

Recurring Guests

Scott Bahr

Scott Bahr

Cairn Consulting Group
Simon Neal

Simon Neal

CampMap
Miguel Huerta

Miguel Huerta

Mexican Glamping Association
Rafael Correa

Rafael Correa

Blue Water Development
Eleonore Hamm

Eleonore Hamm

RVDA Canada
Phil Ingrassia

Phil Ingrassia

RVDA
Michael Moore

Michael Moore

Texas Association of Campground Owners (TACO)

Week 2 - Building Park Value

The second Wednesday of the month focuses on how to build and evaluate park equity physically, operationally, and financially. With insights from designers, operational experts, active park owners, and valuation specialists, this episode covers physical master planning, strategic amenity investments, revenue generation, market valuation, and how to maximize the price your property commands when it’s time to sell.

On September 13th, 2023, we were joined by Jonnie for the MC Fireside Chats.
September 13, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – September 13th, 2023

In the previous episode of MC Fireside Chats, Cara Csizmadia rejoined as a guest host. She led a panel that included special guests Richard Cherry, owner of Cherry Glamping, and Alexander Allred, owner of Blueridge Glamping. Recurring guests Ruben Martinez, founder of the American Glamping Association, and Zach Stoltenberg, Glamping and RV Resort Design Leader at Clockwork, were also present. Together, they delved deep into the nuances of the glamping industry, focusing on sustainability and the integration of technology. The conversation initiated with a focus on the foundational role of sustainability in the glamping industry. The panelists, including Ruben Martinez and Alexander Allred, shared their firsthand experiences, highlighting the high costs and complexities involved in setting up renewable energy sources and aligning sustainability with customer expectations. Richard Cherry emphasized the hidden costs associated with infrastructure development, including sewage and power systems, advising prospective business owners to be realistic in their budgeting. As the discussion progressed, the panelists, including Ruben and Zach, noted a trend towards “shovel-ready” projects to mitigate the risk of delays, emphasizing the importance of setting a realistic opening date to ensure completion. They shared insights on the current investment climate, highlighting a heightened sensitivity to the time taken from the inception to the first booking, a factor becoming increasingly critical in investment decisions. Zach Stoltenberg brought a fresh perspective, encouraging businesses to start with small sustainable choices that can enhance the guest experience while being eco-friendly. He mentioned the evolving industry standards and certifications that can help resorts market themselves as sustainable, adding value to their brand. He also introduced the concept of dark skies compliance as a new classification in the industry, emphasizing the need to start somewhere in the journey towards sustainability. Towards the end of the discussion, Zach shared an exciting development about a potential collaboration with a software company to develop a platform for managing various aspects of a glamping site remotely, enhancing both sustainability and the guest experience. This technology aims to integrate with existing booking software to automate various processes, such as setting key codes and controlling the thermostat based on booking schedules, promising a future where technology significantly aids operational efficiency. As the conversation wound down, there was a light-hearted discussion about the upcoming Glamping Show, with Richard Cherry humorously suggesting bringing zebras as a unique attraction. Despite the confirmation of absence from some panelists, including Alexander Allred and Richard, for the event, there was a shared hope for future meetings and a continuous evolution of the industry. Throughout the conversation, the panelists shared rich insights drawn from their experiences, painting a picture of an industry at the crossroads of tradition and modernity, grappling with the challenges of sustainability while eager to embrace technological advancements to enhance operational efficiency and guest experience. The discussion underscored the dynamic nature of the glamping industry, characterized by a constant balancing act between sustainability, luxury, and profitability.
MC Fireside Chats - this week we were joined by Zach on August 9th, 2023.
August 9, 2023

MC Fireside Chats- August 9th, 2023

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, the transformative journeys within the glamping universe took center stage. Sponsored by Horizon Outdoor Hospitality, the episode began with a fresh introduction, showcasing the show’s commitment to bringing weekly conversations with thought leaders, entrepreneurs, and outdoor hospitality experts. Brian Searl expressed his enthusiasm for the new introduction, highlighting the show’s evolution and its dedication to keeping content fresh and engaging for its audience. The distinguished panel for the episode comprised industry experts and enthusiasts. Zach Stoltenberg, from Clockwork; and Connor Schwab, VP at Sage Outdoor Advisory, all shared their insights and experiences. Special attention was given to the unique stories of the episode’s special guests. Chris Jeub, the owner of Monument Glamping, delved into his inspiring transition from an educator to a glamping site owner. His journey showcased the diverse paths individuals take to enter the world of glamping and the passion that drives them. Vidar Velle, the visionary founder of Nordic Glamping based in the UK, was another highlight of the show. Vidar discussed the intricacies of setting up glamping structures, emphasizing the blend of luxury and nature. He also shared enthralling tales of glamping amidst the wilderness, painting a vivid picture of the experiences guests can expect. Recurring guests, Zach from Clockwork and Connor Schwab from Sage Outdoor Hospitality, also shared updates on their projects and the latest trends in the glamping industry. Their insights provided a comprehensive look into the current state of the industry and its future trajectory. The episode was not just an exploration of glamping but also a testament to the growth and potential of the outdoor hospitality industry. With a mix of expert opinions, personal journeys, and industry insights, MC Fireside Chats continues to be a beacon for those interested in outdoor hospitality. In conclusion the episode offered a deep dive into the world of glamping. From personal journeys to industry trends, the episode provided a holistic view of the glamping universe, making it a must-watch for enthusiasts and professionals alike.
MC Fireside Chats this week we were joined by Az on July 12th.
July 12, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – July 12th, 2023

In the previous episode of MC Fireside Chats presented by Modern Campground and hosted by Brian Searl, the discussion had begun with Sharon and Tony Turner sharing their experience of running the glamping site, Glamping Retro, in Tennessee. They had emphasized the importance of providing a unique and comfortable experience for their guests, which included providing amenities like a hot tub, a fire pit, and a grill. They had also mentioned that they had a variety of accommodations, including treehouses, airstreams, and bell tents. Adrian and Carol Passos, owners of a glamping site Caracol Glamping in the UK, had shared that they had a variety of accommodations, including shepherd’s huts, bell tents, and a converted horse box. They had also emphasized the importance of providing a unique and comfortable experience for their guests. Zach Stoltenberg had discussed the importance of providing a unique and comfortable experience for guests. He had mentioned that as the glamping market was becoming more saturated, it was important for glamping sites to differentiate themselves by providing unique experiences and amenities. The discussion had then turned to the future of the glamping industry. The panelists had agreed that as the industry was becoming more saturated, glamping sites would need to continue to innovate and provide unique experiences to attract guests. They had also discussed the potential for glamping sites to become more upscale and luxurious. The panelists had also discussed the importance of marketing in the glamping industry. They had mentioned that social media was a crucial tool for marketing their sites and attracting guests. They had also discussed the importance of telling the story of their sites and creating a strong brand. The discussion had then turned to the potential for growth in the glamping industry. The panelists had discussed the possibility of expanding their sites and adding more accommodations. They had also discussed the potential for hosting events, such as weddings, at their sites. The panelists had also discussed the challenges of running a glamping site. They had mentioned that they were seasonal businesses, which could present challenges in terms of revenue and operations. They had also discussed the challenges of maintaining their sites and providing a high level of service to their guests. The discussion had concluded with the panelists discussing the future of the glamping industry. They had expressed optimism about the future of the industry and the potential for growth and innovation. They had also expressed their excitement about the potential for glamping to continue to evolve and provide unique and memorable experiences for guests.
June 14, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – June 14th, 2023

During the MC Fireside Chats episode last June 14 presented by Modern Campground, David Smith started the conversation by reintroducing Outside Capital, a financial investment management firm specializing in outdoor hospitality. Their portfolio ranges from glamping and campgrounds to nature-based hotels, and they provide financial backing for deals in the industry, also leading their own projects. Dimphy discusses the inception of her campsite in Romania. She shares how the concept of glamping, relatively new in Romania, has gained popularity, particularly among Bucharest’s city dwellers looking for weekend getaways. She observes that her campsite, strategically located near the capital, is experiencing increasing traction. Annette of Rustic Rook Resort describes their establishment nestled 19 miles from Colorado’s Great Sand Dunes National Park. The resort, which opened in 2020, offers 30 glamping tents, presenting breathtaking views of the dunes and surrounding mountains. Irene Wood highlights the rising interest in the glamping industry as reflected in the increase in relevant articles and publications. She and David Smith concur with Brian’s assertion that the glamping industry usually starts with small operators, gradually attracting more substantial investments. Connor Schwab sees a maturation process unfolding in the RV and campground industry. He envisions a future where the sector becomes more institutionalized and integrates technology to match the hotel industry’s sophistication, particularly regarding dynamic pricing, reservation systems, and marketing. In the panel discussion, Annette delves into the story of Rustic Rook Resort. She and her husband noticed a high demand for campgrounds in Colorado and, utilizing their construction background, constructed their glamping site, opening its doors in 2020. Despite observing significant interest in the camping industry, she warns that it’s not a get-rich-quick scheme due to the immense work and stress involved in managing such a venture. The panelists agree that the future of the glamping industry is promising. Irene Wood remarks that travel patterns changed after Covid-19, and brands who’ve established a lifestyle brand rather than merely providing accommodation stand a better chance at success. She also cautions about an increasing number of brokers looking to offload struggling glamping operations, suggesting potential threats to the industry. The panel also navigates through the economic challenges that businesses face, including rising costs and aggressive competition. They observe some struggling businesses that did not anticipate these challenges in their initial project costs. To stay competitive, these businesses lower their pricing, which could lead to potential washouts. Meanwhile, some businesses like RV parks are thriving and expanding their services, showing resilience in the changing economic climate. The group then discusses Dimphy’s business in Romania. Dimphy finds her business performing well, given the extended operating season. She highlights the role nationality plays in her campsite’s reputation, with positive reviews from German guests leading to an influx of other European visitors. However, she also outlines several challenges, including securing flat spaces for RV parking, establishing a reliable water supply, and dealing with local economic and inflationary issues. The participants then delve into the real estate aspect, led by David. He discusses the complexities of the current real estate market, citing increased interest rates and floating rate loans as major obstacles. He notices that various sectors, including multifamily apartment buildings and the hotel industry, are being affected. Despite the difficulties, David emphasizes the importance of resilience and building successful businesses to withstand regular business cycles and exceptional situations. Annette shares her insights on the trials of running a hospitality business, going beyond the allure of the”dream” phase and into the reality of daily challenges. Irene Wood humorously suggests a support group for owner-operators in hospitality to cope with unpredictable challenges. The group also discusses market saturation in the glamping industry, with Connor expressing concerns about the rapid increase of glamping resorts. Annette suggests engaging with local planning commissions to gather occupancy data from all campgrounds, which could help evaluate if the market can sustain new businesses. The main objective is to foster a sustainable business environment and prevent a saturation leading to widespread failures. They also ponder on various factors influencing market saturation, such as effective marketing and managing customer expectations. Despite acknowledging few nearing saturation markets, they argue it’s not only about saturation but also about the appropriateness of businesses to their markets. They also discuss the concept of opportunity costs in outdoor hospitality businesses, which often do not run full seasons due to factors like zoning regulations. David Smith states that while market saturation is a concern, businesses should not solely rely on it. He underscores the importance of offering a unique and differentiated glamping experience.
Mc rescue chats - this week we were joined by angela miller for the MC Fireside Chats on April 12th, 2023.
May 12, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – April 12th, 2023

In the April 12th episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosts Brian Searl and Cara Czismadia were joined by glamping experts to discuss the latest trends of the evolving industry. This week’s panel included recurring guest and Founder of the American Glamping Association, Ruben Martinez, as well as special guests the owner of Creekside RNR Glamping, Angele Miller, and the owner of The Destination Glamping Resort, Skip Courtney, who shared their insights and experiences, offering valuable perspectives on the glamping industry. The conversation centered around the challenges and opportunities faced by glamping businesses in the context of the Covid-19 pandemic, shifting guest expectations, and the importance of adaptability. Angele Miller discussed her strategy to enhance guest experiences by partnering with local farms and companies. Miller’s resort offers luxurious dome structures and unique mirror cabins, providing memorable experiences like llama hiking and Nordic Spa retreats. To ensure clear communication with guests, Miller introduced premium amenities such as custom soaps and organic olive oil to align with their expectations. Skip Courtney entered the glamping business after attending a conference in Denver and embracing the safari tent concept. Courtney’s resort features luxurious amenities, and he built a stage for live music to further enhance the guest experience. He noted that the majority of his business comes from within a 150-mile radius, suggesting that utilizing booking channels like VRBO or Airbnb may attract more distant guests. The participants also discussed the importance of adaptability in the glamping market due to the changing environment and increasing competition. Instead of relying solely on high prices, they emphasized the need to focus on building a sustainable brand that offers unique experiences for guests. The conversation also touched upon finding the right pricing strategy, with Courtney sharing his experience of incrementally increasing rates to find the optimal price point for his market. Looking ahead, the panelists predicted an increase in demand for outdoor experiences and glamping as more people seek to disconnect from their daily lives and reconnect with nature. They expect the wellness aspect of glamping to grow, with more people viewing these adventures as opportunities for relaxation and healing. The group anticipates a rise in unique experiences and partnerships between glamping businesses and other sectors of the hospitality industry. The participants underscored the importance of taking a step back to assess and adjust to changing market conditions. They emphasized the impact of small details, such as well-made beds and fresh flowers, on guests’ experiences and word-of-mouth marketing. The episode provided valuable insights into the glamping industry, highlighting the need for adaptability, marketing adjustments, and enhanced guest experiences. As the market continues to evolve, glamping resort owners must innovate and partner with local businesses to provide unique offerings that cater to the ever-changing expectations of their guests.
This week we were joined by MC Fireside Chats.
March 8, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – March 8, 2023

Welcome to MC Fireside Chats, a weekly show brought to you by Modern Campground, featuring guests from the outdoor hospitality industry. This episode is sponsored by Horizon Outdoor Hospitality. In this week’s glamping episode, we are joined by Ruben Martinez, Founder of Glamping Hub and the American Glamping Association, and Zach Stoltenberg, Glamping and RV Resort Design Leader, as well as two special guests – Alessandro van de Loo, board member of Vacanze col Coure, and Jim Haughton, general manager of NovaDome. Together, they share their unique perspectives on the challenges faced by glamping operators, the need for innovation and adaptation, and the importance of creating unique customer experiences. From insights into the Italian and Dutch glamping markets to designing and constructing dome-shelter-type glamping accommodations, this episode covers it all. So, sit back, relax, and join us as we dive into the world of glamping on MC Fireside Chats. The experts discussed various aspects of the glamping industry, including innovations and adaptations to different seasons to expand the market, and the push towards all-season glamping accommodations. They also talked about the challenges of catering to different seasons and diversifying offerings to open up new activities and possibilities. Alessandro van de Loo shared his insights on the Italian and Dutch glamping markets. He shared the challenges of operating a family-friendly resort geared towards school holidays and how they utilized focusing on food, beverage, and outdoor wellness during off-seasons to provide a unique customer experience. Jim Haughton highlighted the durability and low maintenance of the fiber-glass shelter dome accommodations by NovaDome, which are designed to withstand all seasons, making them an excellent investment for glamping operators. Ruben Martinez talked about the evolution of the glamping industry over the last decade and the importance of mature conversations and exit strategies. Zach Stoltenberg emphasized the growing importance of authenticity in the guest experience. Overall, the show provided valuable insights into the challenges faced by glamping operators, the need for innovation and adaptation, and the importance of creating unique customer experiences.
Mc rescue chats - this week we were joined by MC Fireside Chats.
February 8, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – February 8, 2023

With the glamping industry’s continued growth, leaders shared their insights on the current state of glamping and the challenges faced in this week’s episode of MC Fireside Chats. Glamping has been growing in popularity in recent years and has undergone a significant transformation in the UK. The industry is a diverse and flexible alternative form of accommodation, providing a unique experience for guests and the opportunity for landowners to diversify their land. Kate Morel, Founder & Creative Director of Morel Company, shared her excitement about the future of the UK’s glamping industry. She talked about the need for solid design concepts and the challenge of rising material costs and the value of land. Despite these challenges, Morel is confident that glamping offers a more immersive experience for guests. Ruben Martinez, Founder of Glamping Hub and the American Glamping Association, talked about the entrepreneur spirit and the challenges of labor and planning. He emphasized the unpredictability of location and how it affects both labor and planning, highlighting the struggle that glamping entrepreneurs face. Whitney Scott, COO of Terramor Outdoor Resort, talked about the startup mentality of the industry and how technology is helping operators provide the next level of the guest experience. Scott believes that defining glamping can stifle creativity and that Terramor is an evolution of the traditional form of glamping. The Terramor experience offers a unique set of accommodations, an intentional and elevated food experience, and excellent customer service. However, she also mentioned the rising cost of construction and the difficulty of building in remote locations, as well as the need for workforce housing. David Smith of Outside Capital shared his insights on investments in the industry and how the tone of real estate capital has changed. He discussed the difficulties in getting deals done and the higher cost of capital compared to a few years ago. Despite these challenges, Smith believes that the industry offers a risk-adjusted return opportunity that traditional hospitality cannot offer and that the industry can benefit from continued interest. He advised glamping entrepreneurs to budget appropriately, build a healthy contingency, and be flexible enough to adapt. Connor Schwab, Vice President of Outdoor Hospitality at Sage Outdoor Advisory, mentioned that while the cost of capital and materials are high, demand and nightly occupancy are also high, and interest in the industry has never been higher. During the CampVantage segment of the show, experts discussed the new AI tool ChatGPT, how it could help bridge the gap in the industry, and emphasized the importance of technology in alleviating some of the challenges faced by the industry. The glamping industry is facing challenges, but with the entrepreneur spirit, the use of technology, and the continued interest from both investors and guests, the future of glamping looks bright.
Mc rescue chats - this week we were joined by MC Fireside Chats.
January 11, 2023

MC Fireside Chats – January 11, 2023

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, glamping industry experts discussed some of the operational and logistical aspects and challenges in the glamping space and how to create a unique space that offers a unique experience to guests. Sara Gladstone, the founder and managing director of Glamping Innovations, talked about the UK’s glamping industry, its significant growth over the years, and how glamping businesses in the UK continue to innovate amid the ever growing market. As we dive into this episode, experts discussed the endless possibilities in the industry, seasonality, and how glamping owners can use its weaknesses and strengths. Zach Stoltenberg, a glamping design leader, highlighted that glamping is not so much about the accommodation as much as it is the experience, and how glamping operators continuously look for ways that they can really deliver a positive guest experience. Over the years, the definition of glamping has constantly evolved, and more and more businesses continue to offer unique experiences to guests. For the glamping industry experts, there’s no one-size fits all approach to handling a business, but the versatility of the industry helps them provide a better experience to guests. The glamping industry is continuing to innovate, with new and unique glamping accommodations emerging to meet the demands of consumers looking for luxurious camping experiences. The industry’s growth is expected to continue in the coming years, driven by increased awareness and interest in glamping as a vacation option.
On December 14th, we were joined by MC Fireside Chats.
December 14, 2022

MC Fireside Chats – December 14th, 2022

In this week’s episode of MC Fireside Chats hosted by Connor Schwab, glamping industry experts discussed how owners could utilize their properties to provide a unique experience to guests. We are joined by Boris Ryabov of Essential Steam; Ruben Martinez, the founder of Glamping Hub and the American Glamping Association; glamping and RV resort Design Leader Zach Stoltenberg; and John and Nancy Corcoran, the owners of Whispering Springs Wilderness Retreat. As the glamping industry becomes more competitive, Martinez highlighted the importance of having and providing unique, sustainable, and genuine experiences to guests. “It’s not just about amenities; it’s about how you [glamping owners] differentiate yourselves. How do you create a unique experience?” Martinez added. For the Corcorans, one thing they’ve learned from operating a glamping facility is not to be afraid to branch out. Nancy and John utilize Whispering Springs to generate revenue with the help of wedding events. The couple is operating a high-end glamping experience that has seen a tremendous surge in reservations in the first year. They also shared how their business doubled year over year and how they continuously improve and upgrade. Glamping and RV resort design leader Stoltenberg emphasized that glamping is an immersive guest experience and how much involvement and support it takes to provide guests with the best experience. Ryabov of Essential Steam–a communal steam specialist, talked about the guided steam experience that offers communal experience–a combination of guidance and healing that create experiences and creates an environment that helps people experience healing properties. Essential Steam, which provides resorts, retreat centers, and communities with unique and novel outdoor steam spaces, will branch out to glamping and make the outdoor regenerative experience accessible to glampers.

Recurring Guests

Tom Mason, IVEE Group

Tom Mason

IVEE Group
Zach Stoltenberg, Clockwork

Zach Stoltenberg

Clockwork

Landan Dory

North Star Brokerage & Advisory

Jayne Cohen, Campground Consulting Group

Jayne Cohen

Campground Consulting Group

Scott Foos, Horizon Outdoor Hospitality

Scott Foos

Horizon Outdoor Hospitality
Jeremy Johnson, Kona Hills Campground

Jeremy Johnson

Kona Hills Campground
Kaleigh Day, Surf Junction Campground

Kaleigh Day

Surf Junction Campground

Week 3 - Business Operations and Management

On the third Wednesday, we tackle the operational side of running a successful campground. This episode features operations consultants and experts discussing strategies for staff management, technology integration, and maintaining profitability while navigating challenges.

MC Fireside Chats - this week we were joined by Mike Johnson for an exciting conversation.
September 21, 2022

MC Fireside Chats – September 21st, 2022

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, sponsored by Firefly Reservations, we discussed what was on the minds of campground owners with our recurring guests who appear with us once a month to cover various topics: Mike Harrison, from CRR Lifestyle Joe Duemig, from App My Community Additionally, we were joined by Mike Sorensen, President & CEO of Wild Energy Inc. He shared some electric systems and infrastructure that campgrounds might want to consider to make their campground future-ready. MC Fireside Chats is a weekly show focused on the latest news, trends, and commentary from the Outdoor Hospitality Industry with hosts Brian Searl, and Cara Csizmadia.
MC Fireside Chats
July 20, 2022

MC Fireside Chats – July 20th, 2022

In this July episode of MC Fireside Chats, sponsored by Firefly Reservations, we discussed what was on the minds of campground owners with our recurring guests who appeared with us to cover this topic: Mike Harrison, from CRR Lifestyle Joe Duemig, from App My Community Furthermore, we were joined by Simon Neal, Founder of CampMap, a fast-growing start-up expanding across Europe. MC Fireside Chats is a weekly show focused on the latest news, trends, and commentary from the Outdoor Hospitality Industry with hosts Brian Searl, and Cara Csizmadia. The episode was broadcast live on Facebook and YouTube, and is now available for listening as a podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google, Audible, and more.
MC Fireside Chats logo
June 15, 2022

MC Fireside Chats – June 15th, 2022

This week on MC Fireside Chats, presented by Modern Campground, we discussed what’s on the minds of campground owners with our recurring guests who appear once a month with us to cover this topic: Mike Harrison, from CRR Lifestyle Duncan Winship, from Papoose Pond Joe Duemig, from App My Community Plus, we were joined by Nick Purslow, from Glampitect, a company that helps people design glamping sites from conception to completion. We were also joined by Kevin & Isaac Rains, Owners of Dappled Light Adventures who have glamping rentals located inside Daniel Boone National Forest. MC Fireside Chats is a weekly show focused on the latest news, trends, and commentary from the Outdoor Hospitality Industry with hosts Brian Searl, and Cara Csizmadia. Watch live on Facebook, and YouTube, or listen later as a podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Google, Audible, and more.
MC Fireside Chats logo
January 19, 2022

MC Fireside Chats – January 19th, 2022

This week on MC Fireside Chats, we were joined by Kevin Long, CEO & Co-Founder of The Dyrt. Plus, by some brand new recurring guests who will appear once a month with us to have a candid discussion on what park owners are thinking about right now: – Heather Blankenship, owner of Pigeon Forge Jellystone – Joe Duemig, from App My Community
An image of a person in a circle promoting Furever Clean Dog Wash.
December 15, 2021

MC Fireside Chats – December 15th, 2021

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, we wrapped up 2021 with a look back at some of the most important stories. Additionally, we chatted with a park manager about their Christmas activities, an owner who expanded their park, and speculated about what 2022 had in store for the industry.
MC Fireside Chats logo
September 15, 2021

MC Fireside Chats – September 15th, 2021

This week on MC Fireside Chats, presented by Modern Campground, we dove deep into the world of glamping with a collection of industry experts. We heard from David Korse, organizer of The Glamping Show USA, about their upcoming conference. Plus, we chatted with Ruben Martinez from the American Glamping Association and Glamping Hub, Jeff Haynes, a rep for De Waard, and Mike & Anne Howard from HoneyTrek.
MC Fireside Chats logo
July 21, 2021

MC Fireside Chats – July 21st, 2021

We’re back after a break and at our new time! Based on feedback from other park owners and industry suppliers, we’ll be live on Wednesday afternoons now at 1 pm EST. This week we discussed the wide variety of ways you can level up your knowledge as a park owner. From FB Groups to associations and tailored courses to subscription services.
MC Fireside Chats logo
June 21, 2021

MC Fireside Chats – June 21st, 2021

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats: You had all seen the recent stories regarding ransomware attacks on companies both large and small. Combined with viruses, malware, and privacy concerns, it created some uncertainty for campground owners and their guests. We joined together to discuss simple steps you could take to protect your business from these growing threats and how some suppliers were working to provide enhanced protection as well.
MC Fireside Chats logo
May 17, 2021

MC Fireside Chats – May 17th, 2021

What is a third-party management group? What do they do, how do they function, what services do they provide, and perhaps more importantly: Do you need one at your park? In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, we chatted with Kathleen Walsh, CEO of Advanced Outdoor Solutions to help answer these questions! MC Fireside Chats is a weekly show focused on the latest news, trends, and commentary from the Outdoor Hospitality Industry with hosts Brian Searl, and Cara Csizmadia.

Recurring Guests

Jeff Hoffman, Camp Strategy

Jeff Hoffman

Camp Strategy
Sandy Ellingson, RV Industry Advisor

Sandy Ellingson

RV Industry Advisor
Mike Harrison, CRR Hospitality

Mike Harrison

CRR Hospitality
Angele Miller, Creekside RnR Glamping

Angele Miller

Creekside RnR Glamping
Robert Preston, Unhitched Management

Robert Preston

Unhitched Management
Casey Cochran, Campspot

Casey Cochran

Campspot
John McMahon, Camp Door County RV Resort & Campground

John McMahon

Camp Door County RV Resort & Campground

Week 4 - Marketing, AI, and Technology

The fourth Wednesday of the month covers the latest tools and marketing strategies driving innovation in outdoor hospitality. Guests include marketing pros, AI experts, and tech providers exploring personalized marketing, smart technologies, digital engagement, and data-driven operations.

October 22, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – October 22nd, 2025

The latest episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, delved into Marketing, AI, and Technology in outdoor hospitality with guests Greg Emmert, Matt Whitermore, and Brent Parker. They concluded that AI’s most effective role is to be “invisible” to the guest, acting as a force multiplier to streamline operations and enable hyper-personalized service, ultimately enhancing the human experience and allowing guests to disconnect faster once they arrive.
September 24, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – September 24th, 2025

The September 24th episode of MC Fireside Chats covered the rapid acceleration of AI and robotics, emphasizing that outdoor hospitality operators must adopt seamless access control and localized data management to meet rising guest expectations and remain competitive in a rapidly changing industry.
August 27, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – August 27th, 2025

In an episode of MC Fireside Chats focused on marketing, AI, and technology, panelists Brian Searl, Cara Csizmadia, Ravi Parish, Nate Taylor, and Greg Emmert discussed how to balance the integration of new technologies with the crucial need for authenticity and human connection to build trust and ensure the long-term success of businesses in the outdoor hospitality industry.
July 23, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – July 23rd, 2025

In the latest episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl of Insider Perks explores the intersection of marketing, AI, and the campground industry. He’s joined by recurring guests Mychele Bisson of Bison Peak Ventures and Kurtis Wilkins of Rjourney, along with special guests Jeremy Johnson, owner of Kona Hills Campground, and Kieron Wilde of First Nature and Fur Haven. Brian opens the show by welcoming Mychele, who was initially delayed in joining. He then sets the stage by highlighting the show’s focus on marketing and AI, noting the absence of regular guest Greg Emmert due to client commitments. Brian proceeds to introduce Kurtis and Mychele, jokingly stumbling over Mychele’s last name, “Bisson,” which leads to a lighthearted discussion about the pronunciation of French words and Brian’s preference for German. Mychele echoes his sentiment, finding French pronunciation “snotty.” Despite the playful jabs, all agree that French people are “beautiful.” Kurtis Wilkins of Rjourney, who manages and owns 43 campgrounds, speaks first, noting his company’s presence in the industry since 2017. Mychele Bisson then introduces herself as a relative newcomer, having owned six campgrounds from Alaska to Florida for almost two years, and actively growing her portfolio. Brian teases Mychele about potentially owning 800 parks in 16 years, attributing future growth to AI’s impact on systems. Jeremy Johnson, the owner of Kona Hills Campground in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, shares his five-year journey of permitting and entitlements to open his first 80-acre campground with 40 rustic tent camping sites on Lake Superior. He explains that his background in residential real estate investing, coupled with rising housing prices in Marquette, led him to pivot to campgrounds. Jeremy initially envisioned higher-end glamping with cabins but shifted to rustic tent and car camping due to Michigan’s state-level campground licensing requirements for more than two units for short-term stays. He emphasizes the desire to maintain immersion in nature while mindfully adding accommodations. He also shares his positive experiences with car campers, dispelling stereotypes about them being irresponsible, and notes the initial resistance from the local community who feared “homeless people.” Jeremy highlights the inherent demand for his campground due to its proximity to Pictured Rocks National Lakeshore and the city of Marquette, both tourism hubs. He exclusively uses direct bookings through Park for reservations, having delisted from Hipcamp due to backend difficulties and communication challenges with self-service operations. Kieron Wilde, owner of First Nature, a destination management company and tour operator for the West Coast of North America, and Fur Haven, a glamping setup, discusses his 18 years in the industry. He explains that First Nature packages experiences with accommodations and attractions, often selling to tour operators. Kieron also shares his personal journey of relocating to the Columbia River Gorge and the permitting challenges he faced with his Fur Haven project, eventually finding a previously permitted Thousand Trails property. His vision for Fur Haven focuses on the mobility of its A-frame units, allowing them to be relocated seasonally to meet demand for events like concerts or large gatherings. Kieron elaborates on the diverse experiences First Nature offers in the Pacific Northwest, ranging from hiking and whitewater rafting to wine country tours and world-class skiing, emphasizing unique, high-level, and custom private experiences. He also highlights his company’s commitment to sustainability and regenerative tourism. The conversation then shifts to the future of the campground industry, particularly the overlooked opportunity for enhancing guest experiences. Mychele expresses her appreciation for the diversity within the industry, noting how different approaches, like Jeremy’s rustic camping or Kieron’s curated experiences, all thrive. She shares an example of her Alaska park, which, despite appearing like a “parking lot,” serves as a base for guests to explore the surrounding natural beauty of Valdez, leading to community-building events like fish fries. Jeremy elaborates on his future plans for Kona Hills, including developing an old rock quarry for ice climbing and leveraging its proximity to extensive mountain biking trails, drawing inspiration from Bentonville’s success. Kurtis chimes in, reinforcing the idea of unique experiences for each Rjourney campground and jokingly blames his unusual quietness on allergies and nearby wildfires in Washington. The discussion then pivots to the impact of AI on marketing and the industry. Brian introduces the new ChatGPT agent, which can perform actions like booking itineraries and checking calendars by connecting to personal data, calling it just the “beginning.” He then mentions Perplexity’s new browser, which runs locally on a computer, emphasizing that the future will involve AI making decisions based on website content without human interaction. Kurtis envisions a future where websites communicate via robust APIs with AI agents, facilitating bookings and reservations. Mychele shares her experience with a prop-AI business that uses AI for cold calling and lead generation, and an AI system called Manus that can book entire trips based on detailed user preferences. She stresses the importance of adapting to AI, noting that “mom and pop” campground owners who resist will be left behind. The panelists discuss the rapid pace of AI development, with Kurtis noting how quickly new technologies become “obsolete.” Mychele highlights the challenge of balancing traditional customer service with AI-driven efficiencies, believing that AI can free up staff to focus on human-centric customer service. Brian plays devil’s advocate, suggesting that even a robot could provide a “human experience” by fulfilling guest needs. The conversation touches on the broader societal implications of AI, including job displacement and the growing wealth gap. They express concern about the lack of public discourse on these issues and the rapid approach of “super-intelligence.” Mychele emphasizes the need for businesses to adapt to AI-driven search and booking methods to remain competitive. The episode concludes with Brian, Mychele, and Kurtis discussing the accelerating pace of AI development and its profound impact on all aspects of life. They muse about a future where humanoid robots could be commonplace and even become integrated into personal relationships. Mychele stresses that businesses must embrace AI to stay relevant, and Kurtis and Brian acknowledge the difficulty of keeping up with the rapid changes. Brian, acknowledging the extended discussion, wraps up the show by thanking his guests and promoting his other podcast, “Outwired,” which will continue the conversation on the future of campgrounds.
June 25, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – June 25th, 2025

In the recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, a new focus for the Week 4 show was introduced, shifting away from the RV industry to concentrate on marketing, AI, and technology. Host Brian Searl, CEO of Insider Perks and Modern Campground, opened the show by explaining this new direction and the reshuffling of some recurring guests. He noted that Phil from RVDA of America and Eleonore from RVDA of Canada would now appear on the Week 1 show, which covers data, trends, and analytics. Greg Emmert, the founder of Verio Outdoor Hospitality Consulting, was introduced by Brian, who joked that he was kept on the panel out of pity. Greg then introduced himself and his consulting firm, which helps clients build their operations “strategically and with soul.” He and Brian also made light of the new website Brian’s team is building for his company. Kurtis Wilkins, a new recurring guest from Rjourney RV Resorts and Advanced Outdoor Management, was welcomed to the show. He clarified that he goes by “Kurtis” professionally to distinguish himself from another “Kurtis” in his office. He explained that his company has 41 branded locations and over 12,000 RV pads, with a focus on front-end sales and the monetization of camping. Sam Dagenhard, the founder and CEO of Campfire Ranch, was introduced as a special guest. He described his company as an outdoor hospitality brand based in Gunnison, Colorado, which is building a collection of properties with a focus on “subscale” locations of 30 rooms or less. He said this allows for a high-touch, intimate experience where they can know guests by name. He also stated that his company offers a range of experiences from camping to backcountry trips, always located near prime outdoor recreation spots. Sam later revealed that he grew up RVing and camping and began putting his ideas on paper after moving to Los Angeles, where he found himself limited by state park and national forest campgrounds. He started organizing large, informal group camping trips to places like Joshua Tree, which inspired him to design an ideal campground for his generation. He took a leap in 2019, leaving his job in sports marketing at Red Bull to find his first location, intending to build a brand that would eventually span coast to coast and offer a unique, one-of-a-kind experience. The discussion began with a topic brought up by Kurtis Wilkins, who spoke about the transition from traditional SEO to what his team is calling “AEO,” or AI Engine Optimization. He noted that 13% of search traffic had recently been diverted away from Google, which is a significant change being discussed in many marketing departments. Brian Searl responded by sharing his belief that traditional SEO is “dead” because as AI gets smarter, it will be impossible to “trick” Google. He argued that the new focus should be on providing valuable content that AI systems can easily understand. He then asked Sam Dagenhard about his recent experience with a website redesign and SEO report. Sam said that in the beginning, SEO was all about inserting keywords into copy, which felt “wonky.” He has now learned that other factors like speed and security also play a role. He explained that his company is still young, and their initial website on Squarespace was a prototype for a 17-site campground where SEO happened “by accident.” As his company has grown, they are now transitioning to a more robust website and are in the copywriting phase. He found it interesting to see how much AI was already picking up about his business during a brand discovery audit. He believes it is crucial for his internal team to write the website copy to maintain the authentic, high-touch relationship they have with guests. Kurtis Wilkins agreed with Sam’s starting point, acknowledging that his experience with SEO 10 years ago was the same. He said that good SEO has always been about providing what Google wants and doing it in a structured way. He emphasized the importance of localized content and using backlinks from community groups like the Boy Scouts to build relevance. He noted that his current focus is on creating structured, targeted information, localized to the community and the user searching for it, regardless of their location. He expressed a desire to hear more from Brian on this. Greg Emmert offered a historical perspective on SEO, recalling his first website when people used Yahoo and a “web crawler” for search results. He admitted that he learned little about SEO and was more focused on daily operations like plunging toilets. He stated that his new website, built by Brian’s team, is being tailored for “LLM” (Large Language Model) searches, which he called “AEO,” a term he admitted to stealing from Kurtis. He explained that he is now focused on conversational, narrative-style writing that sounds like he is speaking, which he sees as the future of search. He also mentioned his recent experience with a different consulting company, noting how quickly the SEO landscape has changed in just two years. Brian Searl added to the discussion, emphasizing that everyday people don’t need to be SEO experts but should know enough to ask the right questions of their marketing partners. He suggested using tools like ChatGPT to learn the basics. He reinforced the idea that Google has always wanted websites to write for the user, and providing valuable, easy-to-understand content is key. He cited an example of a client’s property in Arizona, Verde Ranch RV Resort, where a page about bicycle rentals could help them win search queries from users and AI systems looking for that specific amenity in the area. He stressed that a page dedicated to a specific offering is far more powerful than a simple bullet point on an amenities list. Kurtis Wilkins agreed with Brian’s point about providing value, stating that Google’s core function is to be a good recommender for its users. He also mentioned that RV parks are “many businesses in one business,” and each component, from waterparks to gift shops, needs to be optimized for search. He added that “social proof” from reviews and listings also plays an increasingly important role. Brian agreed, highlighting that brand building, press releases, and social media conversations are crucial signals that AI uses to understand a business. Brian then invited Sam to elaborate on how Campfire Ranch got started. Sam explained his lifelong love for the outdoors, starting with RVing with his family. After moving to LA for a career in sports marketing with Red Bull, he felt a gap in the market for a campground designed for his generation. He started organizing group camping trips where he would rent and set up all the gear for friends, realizing the barrier to entry for camping was the equipment itself. This led to his business model, which focuses on providing gear and equipment. He also emphasized the importance of building community, noting he loves when guests line up for the bathroom because it encourages them to talk and make friends. He said that this high-touch approach has also led to partnerships with manufacturers like North Face who provide gear for rentals. He stated that Campfire Ranch is an “RV-free” campground, focusing on tent, car, and van camping. Greg Emmert praised Sam’s business model, calling it “underserved” and noting that car camping is on the rise. He commended Sam’s courage in creating a business that is different from the typical RV park model. Kurtis Wilkins added that while he loves tent campers, many local governments and municipalities prevent RV parks from offering tent camping or “van camping.” Sam replied that Campfire Ranch’s walk-in tent sites are priced at a premium because they offer the best views, proving that if you cater to tent campers and make them feel important, they will come. He said that this intentional design choice comes from understanding what customers want and that it is a great reality check against assumptions. Brian Searl concluded the main discussion by highlighting the difference between a business owner and an entrepreneur, noting the courage it takes to pursue a niche like Sam has. With the hour approaching, the panelists prepared to wrap up. Brian extended an invitation to Sam to become a recurring guest on the show, which Sam accepted. The show ended with Brian encouraging the audience to connect with Sam at Campfire Ranch, Kurtis at Rjourney, and Greg at his new consulting company, Verio. The group signed off, mentioning the upcoming Outwired podcast to discuss credit card fraud and heat safety.
May 28, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – May 28th, 2025

On May 28th, 2025, another insightful episode of MC Fireside Chats unfolded, hosted by Brian Searl of Insider Perks and Modern Campground. This particular session was dedicated to the RV industry and outdoor recreation, bringing together a panel of recurring experts and special guests to dissect current trends, share operational experiences, and forecast future developments. Brian warmly welcomed the audience and introduced the day’s lineup, setting the stage for a comprehensive discussion that spanned from high-level industry statistics to on-the-ground business strategies. The episode featured its regular contributors from the RV Dealers Association (RVDA): Eleonore Hamm, President of RVDA of Canada, and Phil Ingrassia, President of RVDA of the US. Eleonore outlined her association’s focus on education, advocacy, and ensuring the profitability and sustainability of Canadian RV dealers. Phil echoed these sentiments, highlighting the US RVDA’s mission to support dealers and collaborate with manufacturers and suppliers on initiatives like the Go RVing program, which promotes the RV lifestyle in their respective countries. Their presence provided a crucial overview of the North American RV market landscape. Joining the seasoned regulars were two special guests making significant waves in their local outdoor hospitality sectors. Ilia Smirnov, owner of Cape Fear River Adventures and the Cozy Heron Glamping Resort, was introduced first. Located near Raleigh, North Carolina, Ilia’s businesses offer a unique blend of river-based activities and distinctive glamping accommodations. Following Ilia, Lisa Green, the General Manager of the Decatur Wheeler Lake KOA Campground in Alabama, shared her experiences. Lisa described her campground as an activity-driven destination, emphasizing her journey into the industry and the strategies she has employed. The discussion kicked off with an industry update from Phil Ingrassia and Eleonore Hamm. Phil shared that April’s wholesale RV shipments in the US saw a pleasant 4% increase compared to the previous year, though he noted that retail sales for April were not yet available and had been lagging slightly, with March retail sales down about 14% year-over-year, indicating an inventory build-up as dealers prepared for the season. He acknowledged that consumer sentiment, influenced by job prospects, the stock market, savings, and gas prices, plays a significant role in RV sales, predicting that the year would likely end up similar to the last. Eleonore Hamm provided the Canadian perspective, noting a similar trend where wholesale shipments outpaced retail sales. She explained that Canadian dealers had been rapidly building inventory due to concerns about tariffs and counter-tariffs, particularly the 25% counter-tariff on US-manufactured motorhomes that came into effect on April 9th, though towables were fortunately excluded. This uncertainty led to a cautious approach from dealers, with new unit sales down about 10% year-over-year by the end of March. Eleonore elaborated on the complexities of these tariffs, linked to HS codes where motorhomes are classified under automotive, and mentioned ongoing advocacy efforts to government to remove motorhomes from this tariff. Both Phil and Eleonore agreed that the late spring and early summer period is crucial for sales volume. Shifting to consumer behavior, Brian Searl inquired about RV ownership and usage. Phil Ingrassia revealed that data on RVs in operation, a proprietary number, has been growing consistently, even through the pandemic and beyond. He estimated that the number of RVs in operation has increased from around 3.5 million in 2010 to over 6.5 million currently. This indicates that people are holding onto their RVs and renewing registrations. He also mentioned that Go RVing research shows many pandemic buyers have developed a fondness for RV travel and intend to continue, debunking some fears of a mass exodus from the lifestyle. Approximately 1.5 million RVs were sold in North America during the pandemic peak, a significant boost to the installed base. The conversation then turned to Ilia Smirnov, who detailed his entrepreneurial journey. Cape Fear River Adventures, his flagship company, has been operating for 14 years, primarily offering self-guided canoe, kayak, paddleboard rentals, and lazy river tubing on the flat portions of the Cape Fear River. He humorously recounted finding the initial business for sale on Craigslist in 2012. The success of the river adventures paved the way for the Cozy Heron Glamping Resort, now in its third year. Ilia explained that his interest in creating a multi-day destination and the challenge of building on a floodplain led him to discover Conestoga wagons at a trade show, which became the unique lodging solution for his resort, offering a “bridge experience” for those new to the outdoors with comforts like AC and king-size beds. Lisa Green then shared her experiences since becoming the General Manager of the Decatur Wheeler Lake KOA in July of the previous year, a challenging start given her background was in food and beverage, not campground management. She identified that a primary hurdle was rebuilding relationships with staff and the community due to a lack of consistent, customer-service-oriented leadership prior to her arrival. Lisa emphasized the importance of community support and generating auxiliary income. She significantly increased local engagement, noting that previously only 2% of visitors were local, a number she has drastically improved. A key initiative was planning a large music festival featuring only local bands and vendors, which successfully sold out the entire campground well in advance and provided crucial off-season income. The discussion broadened to the importance of marketing and activities in attracting and retaining guests. Eleonore Hamm admitted that it wouldn’t typically occur to her to visit a campground for activities if she wasn’t camping there, highlighting a potential marketing gap. Lisa Green stressed that campgrounds need to offer more activities to engage the 12 to 18-year-old demographic, ensuring they develop positive camping memories that could lead them to become future RV buyers and enthusiasts. Phil Ingrassia concurred, noting that industry research consistently shows individuals who camped as children are significantly more predisposed to engage in RVing later in life, underscoring the value of investing in youth-focused programs and creating “sticky” outdoor experiences. As the episode drew to a close, the guests offered their final thoughts. Lisa Green encouraged everyone to “enjoy a day outdoors, you’ll remember it.” Ilia Smirnov expressed his continued commitment to finding new ways to get people outside and shared that his businesses can be found online at capefearadventures.com. Eleonore Hamm and Phil Ingrassia thanked Brian for the opportunity to hear from campground operators, finding the insights complementary to their perspectives from the RV dealer side. Brian Searl concluded the show, thanking all his guests for the rich conversation and promoting an upcoming podcast, “Outwired,” where he would delve deeper into data trends and consumer niches in the outdoor hospitality sector with Scott Bahr.
April 23, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – April 23rd, 2025

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl convened a panel of industry leaders and experts to explore the multifaceted dynamics of the RV and outdoor recreation sectors. The discussion featured recurring guests Eleonore Hamm from RVDA of Canada, Phil Ingrassia representing RVDA, and Greg Emmert, alongside special guest Eva Mitic, providing a range of perspectives on the current state and future direction of the industry. The episode addressed key issues such as the potential impact of tariffs, the shifting landscape of consumer behavior, and the role of innovation in driving the industry forward. The conversation began with a focus on the looming threat of tariffs and their potential repercussions for the RV industry. Eleonore Hamm provided insights into the Canadian perspective, explaining RVDA of Canada’s efforts to inform its members about the potential impact of counter tariff measures. She highlighted the challenges posed by the lack of a sufficient Canadian supply chain to meet the demand, with a significant portion of RVs sold in Canada being imported from the US. The tariffs, if implemented, would affect RVs crossing the border, potentially increasing costs for dealers and consumers. Phil Ingrassia, speaking from the United States, acknowledged the industry’s shared concerns regarding tariffs and underscored the importance of maintaining free and fair trade between the two countries. He noted the interconnectedness of the US and Canadian RV industries. Brian Searl raised the concern about the potential impact on private campgrounds if tariffs do go into effect. Eleonore Hamm responded that there could be a positive side for Canadian campgrounds as people might choose to camp locally. However, she expressed concern about the long-term impact on dealers and potentially on consumers. Eva Mitic contributed to the conversation by focusing on the role of technology and sustainability in shaping the future of the RV industry. She discussed trends like the increasing importance of user-friendly RV systems and the growing emphasis on sustainable practices. The episode explored how innovations such as lithium technology and artificial intelligence are transforming RV design and functionality, catering to evolving consumer expectations. The discussion also delved into the evolving landscape of consumer behavior in the RV and outdoor recreation sectors. Participants noted a trend toward ease of use and connectivity, as well as the impact of the COVID boom on consumer education and expectations. This has implications for both RV manufacturers and dealers, requiring them to adapt their offerings and strategies to meet changing consumer preferences. Brian Searl prompted the panel to consider various factors influencing the industry, from consumer behavior to technological advancements. Panelists discussed the importance of convenience and intuitive design, as well as the ongoing need to educate consumers about RV operation and maintenance. The episode further explored the challenges and opportunities associated with technological innovation in the RV industry, including the development and adoption of new power systems and the potential influence of electric vehicle technology. The complexities of research and development costs and the balance between innovation and affordability were also considered. The impact of economic uncertainties, including concerns about consumer sentiment and market fluctuations, was a recurring theme. Panelists analyzed the ways in which these factors influence consumer confidence and purchasing decisions, as well as business planning and investment in the RV sector. The discussion also underscored the increasing importance of advancements in RV components and systems, reflecting a broader trend toward enhanced functionality and user experience. The ongoing advancements in power systems and the potential to integrate “smart home” technology into RVs were highlighted as key areas of development. Ultimately, the MC Fireside Chats episode provided a valuable platform for exploring the multifaceted dynamics of the RV industry, bringing together diverse perspectives to analyze current challenges and anticipate future trends. The insights shared by industry experts contributed to a richer understanding of the forces shaping the sector and offered guidance for navigating its ongoing evolution.
March 26, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – March 26th, 2025

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl convened a panel of industry leaders to delve into the pressing issues and evolving trends impacting the RV and outdoor recreation sectors. The discussion featured Eleonore Hamm from RVDA of Canada, Shane Devenish of the Canadian RV Association (CRVA), Greg Emmert, Phil Ingrassia representing RVDA, and Aaron Bannon from the American Outdoors Association. The episode tackled the complex landscape of potential tariffs, shifting consumer behaviors, and the innovative strides being made within the industry, providing valuable insights for campground owners, RV dealers, and outdoor enthusiasts alike. The discussion began with the potential impact of tariffs on the RV industry. Eleonore Hamm explained that RVDA of Canada is providing information and resources to its members regarding potential counter tariff measures. She highlighted the lack of a sufficient Canadian supply chain to meet the demand, with a significant portion of RVs sold in Canada being imported from the US. The tariffs, if implemented, would affect RVs crossing the border, potentially increasing costs for dealers and consumers. Shane Devenish emphasized the difficulty in keeping everyone informed due to the rapidly changing situation. He also clarified that the Canadian countermeasures would only take effect if the US imposes tariffs on Canadian goods. Phil Ingrassia, speaking from Washington D.C., acknowledged the industry’s concern and stressed the importance of free and fair trade. He noted the interconnectedness of the US and Canadian RV industries. Brian Searl raised the concern about the potential impact on private campgrounds if tariffs do go into effect. Eleonore Hamm responded that there could be a positive side for Canadian campgrounds as people might choose to camp locally. However, she expressed concern about the long-term impact on dealers and potentially on consumers. Aaron Bannon provided an overview of the American Outdoors Association, which comprises organizations providing facilitated recreation experiences on public lands. He discussed the crossover between his members and the RV industry, noting that many guides live in RVs and that a robust tourism industry benefits outfitters. Bannon also mentioned trends like the increasing popularity of glamping and a shift towards shorter, less risky trips. Greg Emmert and Shane Devenish weighed in on the trend of shorter trips, linking it to economic uncertainty and fuel costs. Shane Devenish shared anecdotal evidence of some people planning longer trips within Canada. Brian Searl then posed a question about how businesses in different sectors could pivot in a moderately challenging economic scenario. Aaron Bannon suggested that outfitters might focus on attracting customers from nearby metropolitan areas and diversify their offerings. Greg Emmert emphasized the importance of partnerships and experiential offerings for campgrounds, particularly those near population centers. Eleonore Hamm said that Canadian RV dealers might focus more on pre-owned sales and service. Shane Devenish highlighted the challenges faced by parts suppliers and manufacturers on both sides of the border. Phil Ingrassia discussed the complexities of the situation for US manufacturers due to the sourcing of components and the impact of consumer sentiment on RV sales. Phil Ingrassia then discussed the RVIA’s emerging leaders program, which aims to connect and develop industry professionals. Aaron Bannon spoke about similar programs within the Outdoors Association, emphasizing the value of fresh perspectives. Phil Ingrassia also discussed Go RVing’s experiential events, which are designed to introduce RVing to people who may have little exposure to it. Eleonore Hamm added that Go RVing Canada also participates in similar events. Brian Searl then brought up Pebble, an all-electric RV with advanced technology. Greg Emmert provided details about Pebble’s features, including its self-hitching, remote control maneuverability, and extended vehicle range capabilities. Phil Ingrassia noted that the company was founded by former Tesla executives and that these types of innovations may appeal to a new demographic of RVers. In their final thoughts, Eleonore Hamm thanked everyone for the opportunity to speak. Greg Emmert stressed the importance of developing the next generation of leaders in the outdoor hospitality industry. Aaron Bannon highlighted the passage of the Explore Act and its potential to facilitate new outfitter businesses. Shane Devenish mentioned the CRVA’s 50th anniversary and upcoming special events. Phil Ingrassia expressed optimism about the upcoming season. Eleonore Hamm provided information on how to access the petition regarding tariffs on the RVDA website.
February 26, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – February 26th, 2025

The latest episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, kicked off with the usual banter between recurring guests Greg Emmert and Angele Miller, setting a lighthearted tone before diving into deeper discussions about the RV industry, outdoor recreation, and emerging trends in travel and accommodations. With key players from the RV industry unavailable due to board meetings, the conversation took a broader focus on innovative housing solutions and the evolving landscape of outdoor hospitality. Angele Miller highlighted the growing demand for wellness tourism, emphasizing how nature-based experiences like meditation, yoga, and Nordic-style wellness treatments are attracting more visitors. She pointed out that people are increasingly looking for ways to integrate nature into their well-being, whether through forest bathing, herbal tea rituals, or simply unplugging in scenic environments. This shift aligns with broader travel trends where guests seek holistic experiences rather than just a place to stay. The discussion expanded into economic factors affecting the industry, particularly cross-border travel. Brian and Angele touched on the decline in Canadian travelers heading to the U.S. due to the weak Canadian dollar and political factors, with more locals opting for domestic vacations instead. This has resulted in an uptick in Canadian campground reservations, highlighting the economic shifts that are reshaping travel habits. Brent Fullerton, general manager of Carefree RV, provided insights into customer service strategies that are refining RV sales and rentals. He discussed the industry’s need to improve the service experience, especially given labor shortages and the challenge of keeping up with seasonal demand. Brent emphasized that while the RV industry has traditionally been laid-back, the current economic climate requires a more proactive approach to customer service, faster response times, and greater efficiency in handling repairs and parts shortages. He also noted the importance of adapting to changing consumer expectations, particularly in an era where customers demand high-quality service and instant solutions. Arthur Jason, CEO of AC Future, introduced his company’s AI-powered transformer homes, which were recently showcased at CES 2025. These modular, off-grid living spaces use artificial intelligence to optimize energy use, harvest water from the air, and create a self-sustaining environment. Arthur explained how these units offer a high-end, flexible alternative to traditional housing and could redefine the concept of mobile living. He also touched on their potential application for glamping, RV parks, and sustainable outdoor accommodations, making them an attractive option for operators looking to enhance guest experiences with cutting-edge technology. Greg Emmert and Brian explored the broader implications of AI-driven housing and its role in shaping the future of outdoor travel. They discussed the potential for these homes to be integrated into themed glamping resorts, offering curated experiences that cater to specific demographics. From a Mars-themed desert retreat to a high-tech forest getaway, these modular homes could provide a unique alternative to traditional cabins and yurts, pushing the boundaries of outdoor hospitality. The conversation also touched on the larger societal shifts toward automation and AI, with Brian speculating on the impact of robotic assistants in everyday life. He noted that fully functional humanoid robots could be available within the next few years for as little as $20,000 to $30,000, potentially transforming domestic life and further influencing travel habits. The panel debated whether these advancements would lead to greater mobility, with people embracing flexible, technology-driven living spaces instead of traditional homes. As the episode wrapped up, each guest reflected on the opportunities and challenges ahead. Arthur reiterated his commitment to bringing AC Future’s homes to Canada, while Brent acknowledged the need for continued innovation in the RV industry to meet evolving customer demands. Angele emphasized that regardless of technological advancements, the fundamental appeal of outdoor recreation remains the same: people seek connection with nature and meaningful experiences. The episode served as a deep dive into the intersection of outdoor hospitality, technology, and shifting consumer behaviors. With innovative solutions like AI-powered homes and evolving approaches to RV sales and rentals, the industry is adapting to a changing landscape where customer expectations, economic pressures, and sustainability concerns are reshaping the future of travel and outdoor living.

Recurring Guests

Mychele Bisson, Bison Peak Ventures

Mychele Bisson

Bison Peak Ventures
Cara Csizmadia, Canadian Camping & RV Association

Cara Csizmadia

Canadian Camping & RV Association
Matt Whittemore, Climb Capital

Matt Whittemore

Climb Capital
Ravi Parikh, RoverPass

Ravi Parikh

RoverPass
Sarah Stahl, Market Movers

Sarah Stahl

Market Movers

Week 5 - Multi-Sector Show

On the rare occasions when a month has a fifth Wednesday, we present a special multi-sector episode. This collaborative platform brings together a diverse panel of guests from the glamping, campground, RV, outdoor recreation, and activities industries. The rich discussion fosters a multifaceted understanding, offering varied perspectives and insights from across these sectors.

September 30, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 30th, 2026

During the September 30, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, property operators Stephanie Bias and Munro Murdock emphasized that the future of outdoor hospitality relies on blending invisible backend technology with highly curated, generation-specific guest experiences—ranging from luxury all-inclusive glamping to diverse, nature-focused hybrid parks.
July 29, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 29th, 2026

Industry experts on the July 29th MC Fireside Chats emphasized that hospitality operators must first document their internal workflows to successfully adopt AI and digital tools, enabling them to streamline operations, personalize guest experiences, and increase profitability without losing the essential human touch.
April 29, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 29th, 2026

Host Brian Searl and a panel of outdoor hospitality experts—including Marie Nichols, Duncan Winship, and Ashley Cary—discussed how international travel apps, changing generational preferences, and data-driven marketing are transforming the modern camping industry.
October 29, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – October 29th, 2025

The latest MC Fireside Chats episode focused on how glamping operators are revolutionizing outdoor hospitality by prioritizing unique, high-touch guest experiences and personal connection, demonstrating that success in the industry, regardless of scale or location, relies on moving beyond simple accommodation.
July 30, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – July 30th, 2025

In this special fifth week episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl welcomes three glamping pioneers—from the UK to Costa Rica—for a global look at the evolving outdoor hospitality landscape. The guests dive into everything from guest engagement and winter operations to marketing challenges, AI, and the future of glamping.
April 30, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – April 30th, 2025

The MC Fireside Chats episode on April 30th, 2025, began with host Brian Searl acknowledging technical difficulties at the start of the show. Brian then introduced the guests: Mychele Bisson, Mary Sparrow, and Heidi Royle, each bringing a unique perspective on the outdoor hospitality industry. Mychele Bisson shared her work with Bison Peak Ventures, acquiring campgrounds across the country, revitalizing them, and aiming to preserve the original family’s legacy. She emphasized the importance of maintaining the essence of these establishments while introducing modern improvements. Mary Sparrow discussed her ownership of a boatyard in the east of England and her innovative approach to hospitality with floating glamping pods. Her business evolved from traditional houseboats to unique, luxury floating accommodations, offering guests a distinctive experience on the water. Heidi Royle detailed her journey of establishing the Groove Glamping, a glamping site in Minnesota, located near a state park. She highlighted the natural attractions of the area, such as the clear water creeks and the state park, which enhance the appeal of her glamping site. The discussion then shifted to the concept of “glamping,” with various perspectives on its definition and evolution. The guests explored how glamping has changed over time, influenced by social media and the increasing demand for unique outdoor experiences. The challenges and strategies of promoting and operating glamping sites were also discussed. Heidi Royle shared her experience with influencer collaborations to increase awareness of the Grove Glamping. Mary Sparrow provided insights into the complexities of running a business that combines traditional boating with modern glamping. This included the unique considerations for floating accommodations and the importance of preserving the natural environment. Mychele Bisson spoke about Bison Peak Ventures’ business model of acquiring and upgrading campgrounds, emphasizing the rewarding aspect of providing families with opportunities to connect and create memories in nature. A significant part of the conversation focused on the personal fulfillment derived from operating these businesses. The guests shared stories of the joy and satisfaction that comes from seeing families and children enjoy the outdoors, away from the distractions of modern technology. The episode concluded with the guests sharing their final thoughts and where to find more information about their businesses. The overarching theme was the value of creating unique outdoor experiences and the positive impact these experiences have on individuals and families.
January 29, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – January 29th, 2025

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl welcomed Josef Hjelmaker, CEO of Electric Outdoors, Robert Preston, CEO and Founder of Unhitched Management, and Matt and Karina Torres, owners of Bayshore RV Park, to discuss their experiences and insights into the outdoor hospitality and RV park industries. The conversation covered everything from business growth and sustainability to unique guest experiences and the future of the industry. Robert Preston shared his journey from a military pilot to a real estate investor, now owning 14 RV parks through Climb Capital and Unhitched Management. His focus is on fostering a sense of community within his parks, providing spaces where guests can disconnect from daily life and reconnect with nature and each other. He emphasized the importance of safe, clean, and welcoming environments in creating a successful RV park experience. His management philosophy revolves around treating employees well so they, in turn, provide exceptional hospitality to guests. He also spoke about his approach to acquiring and scaling parks, explaining that his growth is based on finding good deals while ensuring that each new acquisition enhances the efficiency and effectiveness of his existing properties. Josef Hjelmaker introduced Electric Outdoors, a company focused on sustainability and innovation in outdoor hospitality. His company develops portable, self-sustaining destination platforms that generate their own energy, manage water, and handle waste independently. The units, designed to be placed in remote or off-grid locations, offer a new way to camp without requiring traditional infrastructure or permits. He explained how these platforms provide flexibility for landowners and park operators, allowing them to create new camping experiences in places previously inaccessible to RVs and traditional campers. The conversation also touched on the growing role of electric vehicles in outdoor recreation, with Josef discussing how his technology supports off-grid stays while accommodating the needs of EV travelers. He highlighted the importance of digital integration, explaining how his platforms use connectivity to enhance user experience through booking, energy management, and local activity recommendations. Matt and Karina Torres shared their experience of acquiring and revitalizing Bayshore RV Park on the Washington coast. Their journey began when Matt, a former framer and general contractor, and Karina, with a background in property management, combined their skills to turn their park into a thriving business. They emphasized the importance of hands-on management, directly engaging with guests to provide personalized service and a welcoming atmosphere. They spoke about their approach to balancing long-term and transient guests, their focus on creating unique experiences such as easy access to crabbing in Willapa Bay, and their strategy for reinvesting profits back into the park. They also discussed their long-term goal of eventually hiring a dedicated manager so they can expand to additional properties while ensuring their guests continue to receive the same level of care and hospitality. The discussion highlighted the changing landscape of the outdoor hospitality industry and the increasing importance of offering more than just a place to stay. The guests agreed that creating meaningful experiences for visitors, whether through high-touch customer service, sustainable accommodations, or fostering a sense of community, is key to long-term success. Brian Searl noted that the industry has thrived for years with minimal effort due to economic conditions, but moving forward, park owners will need to be more intentional about guest experiences to maintain and grow their businesses. He pointed out that travelers are looking for something unique, and parks that can deliver on that will be the ones that stand out in an increasingly competitive market. The conversation also touched on the challenges and rewards of park ownership. Robert spoke about the balance between growth and operational efficiency, explaining that his goal is not just to acquire more properties but to ensure each park is well-run and financially sustainable. He emphasized the importance of hiring entrepreneurial-minded managers who treat the business as their own and make decisions that benefit both guests and ownership. Matt and Karina reflected on their initial struggles and learning experiences, including the realization that hiring the wrong staff can impact guest satisfaction. They shared how they adjusted their management approach to be more involved, ensuring that guests feel valued from the moment they arrive. As the discussion wrapped up, Brian announced the launch of a new podcast called Outwired, which will focus on data, AI, and technology in outdoor hospitality. The show will feature unfiltered discussions on industry trends, innovations, and challenges, with co-hosts Greg Emmert from Camp Strategy and Scott Bahr from Cairn Consulting Group. The episode ended with a shared enthusiasm for the future of the outdoor hospitality industry, with all guests expressing optimism about the opportunities ahead for park owners who are willing to innovate and prioritize guest experiences. The insights from this episode underscored the industry’s evolution, with sustainability, community-building, and technology playing a growing role in shaping the next generation of outdoor accommodations.
October 30, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – October 30th, 2024

In the October 30, 2024 episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl brings together several guests to explore various perspectives in outdoor hospitality and the RV industry. The episode features Ken Barber from Wild Haven Glamping, Leslie Taylor-Rharbi from Signature RV Resorts by Zeman, and Paul Craven and Anthony Wollschlager from Airxcel. Brian starts by introducing the guests, encouraging them to share insights about their companies and experiences. Leslie kicks things off by describing her role in managing Zeman’s luxury RV resorts, specifically the “Signature” line, known for providing high-end amenities and tailored experiences. She emphasizes that while they’ve moved away from labeling the resorts as “luxury,” Zeman’s properties continue to offer lush landscapes and a range of amenities like pickleball courts, large clubhouses, and lounges to enhance guest experiences. Ken shares the story of Wild Haven Glamping, discussing how his company provides a mid-tier glamping experience that strikes a balance between comfort and the rustic nature of camping. His properties feature canvas tents and small cabins in scenic locations like Sonoma County and Yosemite, emphasizing a natural and immersive experience over excessive luxury. Ken underscores the challenges they’ve faced, particularly in terms of permits, zoning, and construction, especially with their recent Yosemite property. Despite these hurdles, he and his team focus on delivering unique experiences that attract tourists from across the world. Leslie and Ken agree that evolving guest expectations shape their operations. Leslie notes that Zeman’s properties attract a retiree demographic who expect comfort and quality; however, the increasing demand for “luxury” resorts has redefined the standards of guest experiences, with visitors now expecting amenities akin to high-end hotels. Ken adds that Wild Haven’s guests are typically more open to a stripped-down luxury, opting for a unique natural experience over a traditionally luxurious one. They also touch on the importance of managing expectations through strategic language and marketing, emphasizing terms like “signature” instead of “luxury,” which sets an authentic tone that aligns with their guests’ values. The conversation then shifts to Airxcel, where Anthony and Paul discuss their roles in supplying RV components, such as air conditioners, water heaters, and ventilation systems, that enhance comfort for RV travelers. They explain that Airxcel has a long-standing history in Elkhart, Indiana, the “RV capital” of the U.S., providing essential products to RV manufacturers. Their focus on innovation helps the company anticipate trends, such as the rising demand for sustainable products and off-grid experiences. Paul emphasizes that Airxcel keeps a close watch on industry trends and consumer demands, aiming to deliver products that meet the evolving needs of RV enthusiasts, from full-time RVers to occasional campers. Anthony elaborates on the shift in RV ownership demographics since COVID-19, explaining how younger families and first-time RVers are increasingly investing in the lifestyle. With Airxcel’s established brands, such as Coleman air conditioners and Suburban water heaters, the company leverages its expertise to stay competitive and support new trends in the industry. Paul and Anthony both stress that consumer expectations are driving changes within the RV and camping sectors, where personalization, data-driven guest insights, and seamless technology integration are becoming essential for a superior experience. Brian also dives into potential future trends, sparking an engaging discussion on the influence of AI, automation, and personalization. The guests contemplate how new technology could transform both the outdoor hospitality and RV industries, with Brian suggesting that technology should serve to elevate the guest experience, not detract from it. Ken and Leslie agree, envisioning AI tools that could enable them to provide small, personalized touches, like welcome gifts and birthday recognition, that enhance customer satisfaction without feeling intrusive. Paul underscores the importance of AI in developing more sustainable RV solutions, citing the growing interest in systems that reduce energy use by automatically adjusting to guests’ schedules. Throughout the discussion, the guests emphasize the importance of clear expectations and strong branding. Ken and Leslie both prioritize aligning their offerings with guest expectations, ensuring that their brands promise experiences they can consistently deliver. By avoiding terms like “luxury” and “pampering” in their marketing, both Ken and Leslie are careful to set the right tone for their properties, allowing guests to feel comfortable and engaged in the outdoor experience. The episode concludes with the guests sharing where listeners can find more information about their companies and locations. Ken invites listeners to Wild Haven Glamping in Sonoma County or Yosemite to experience the beauty of Northern California. Leslie and the Airxcel team encourage interested listeners to explore Signature RV Resorts by Zeman and Airxcel’s various product offerings, respectively. The conversation wraps up on a note of optimism, with each guest expressing enthusiasm for the future of outdoor hospitality, the evolution of guest experiences, and the innovations likely to shape the industry in years to come.
July 31, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – July 31st, 2024 

In the July 31st episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, the discussion brought together Pier Tognazzini, founder and COO of MooVert France, and Dustin Sauer, owner of Overland Van Project, to delve into the evolving trends in outdoor hospitality, sustainable tourism, and the growing van life movement. Brian Searl kicked off the episode by acknowledging the uniqueness of the discussion, as it was one of those rare “fifth-week” episodes without the usual lineup of regular guests. Instead, this episode featured a deep dive into niche areas of outdoor hospitality, beginning with Pier Tognazzini. Pier introduced MooVert France, a company dedicated to promoting tourism in France through an eco-friendly and authentic lens. He emphasized MooVert France’s commitment to helping accommodations transition into more sustainable practices by using an algorithm that evaluates properties based on their level of eco-friendliness, sustainability, and authenticity. Pier explained that MooVert is not just about reducing environmental impact but also about offering tourists an experience that goes beyond the typical attractions, allowing them to connect deeply with local culture, heritage, and nature. He provided examples of how MooVert curates these experiences, such as offering stays in tree houses, tiny homes, and even traditional French chateaux. Pier also discussed how MooVert helps property owners make small but impactful changes, such as installing water-saving devices, to enhance sustainability without compromising guest comfort. The conversation also touched on the importance of authenticity, with Pier explaining that MooVert prioritizes experiences that allow travelers to engage with local traditions and communities, such as making cheese in Normandy or harvesting honey in the Alps. Dustin Sauer then introduced Overland Van Project, which specializes in creating high-end, custom expedition vehicles and camper vans designed for those seeking adventure and luxury on the road. Dustin shared the origins of his company, which began as a personal project but quickly grew into a thriving business as demand for custom vans surged during the pandemic. He highlighted how the van life movement, amplified by social media and the hashtag #vanlife, has evolved from a niche lifestyle into a significant trend within the outdoor industry. Dustin discussed the challenges and opportunities within the current market, noting that while there has been a plateau in demand following the pandemic boom, there is still a strong interest in high-quality, custom-built vans. He emphasized the importance of innovation and craftsmanship in differentiating Overland Van Project from other builders, with a focus on integrating advanced features such as hydronic heating systems, high-end electrical setups, and luxury finishes that cater to the specific needs of their clients. Despite the market becoming saturated with both DIY and commercially produced vans, Dustin remains optimistic, citing the enduring appeal of van life and the desire for off-the-grid, self-sufficient travel experiences. The conversation between the three touched on the intersection of sustainability and the outdoor lifestyle. Dustin noted that many of his clients, despite investing in luxury vans, prefer to camp in remote, free locations like BLM lands, rather than traditional RV resorts. This aligns with the growing trend towards authentic, nature-based experiences that Pier’s company, MooVert, also champions. The guests and Brian discussed how this shift reflects broader changes in consumer behavior, where travelers are increasingly seeking out unique and meaningful experiences rather than conventional tourist activities. A significant portion of the discussion was devoted to the challenges of marketing to niche audiences in a competitive landscape dominated by large platforms like Airbnb and Booking.com. Pier and Dustin both emphasized the importance of authenticity in their marketing efforts, whether through social media engagement or creating compelling content that resonates with their target audiences. They acknowledged the difficulties small businesses face in standing out, but also highlighted the potential of social media and viral content to level the playing field. Brian also brought up the role of artificial intelligence (AI) in helping small businesses enhance their marketing strategies and reach. He expressed optimism about how AI could assist companies like MooVert France and Overland Van Project in creating more tailored and effective marketing campaigns, thereby connecting with their niche audiences more efficiently. The episode wrapped up with final thoughts from Pier and Dustin on the future of their respective industries. Pier expressed enthusiasm about the potential expansion of MooVert France into North America, hinting at ongoing discussions with state governments in Nevada and California. Dustin, on the other hand, reiterated his commitment to pushing the boundaries of van design and continuing to provide exceptional, high-quality products for his clients. Overall, this episode of MC Fireside Chats provided a rich exploration of the current trends and future directions in outdoor hospitality, with a strong emphasis on sustainability, authenticity, and the evolving desires of modern travelers. The insights shared by Pier Tognazzini and Dustin Sauer offered valuable perspectives on how businesses can adapt and thrive in this dynamic and competitive industry.