Episodes

Week 1 - Industry Trends & Insights

Each first Wednesday of the month, we dive into the latest trends, market analysis, and predictions in the outdoor hospitality industry. Join industry analysts, market researchers, and outdoor hospitality industry leaders as they unpack topics like market growth, demographic changes, and guest preferences.

October 7, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – October 7th, 2026

During the October 7, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry leaders emphasized that to attract an evolving, experiential demographic, campground operators must hyper-focus on specific niches, adapt to the rise of smaller, rugged RVs, and forge strong cross-sector collaborations.
September 2, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 2nd, 2026

During the September 2, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, outdoor hospitality experts explored the rapid evolution of AI-integrated property management systems and evolving consumer behaviors, emphasizing a market shift toward simpler recreational vehicles and the importance of targeting guests by specific life stages rather than broad generational labels.
August 5, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – August 5th, 2026

In the August 5th episode of MC Fireside Chats, a diverse panel of outdoor hospitality leaders discussed how current economic headwinds are driving a shift from transient RV travel to long-term stays and unique glamping experiences, emphasizing that operators must leverage creative marketing and exceptional, personalized hospitality to thrive in a rapidly changing market.
July 1, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 1st, 2026

In the July 1, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts discussed how macroeconomic factors and shifting generational preferences are pushing the outdoor hospitality sector to prioritize transparent marketing, proactive AI reputation management, and the creation of highly customized, premium “boutique” RV sites.
June 3, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – June 3rd, 2026

In the June 3, 2026 episode of MC Fireside Chats, our panel of industry experts contrasted the current slowdown in traditional RV sales with the rapid, institutional growth of the glamping sector. The discussion also highlighted how American developers can learn from cost-effective European campsite models and stressed the urgent need to prepare campground electrical grids for the incoming wave of all-electric RVs.
May 6, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – May 6th, 2026

In this episode, guest host Scott Bahr and a panel of industry leaders discussed how rising fuel costs and economic pressures are causing campers to favor shorter, more localized trips and “onboarding” through more accessible accommodations. The group emphasized that the industry’s long-term success depends on a shared responsibility to simplify the guest experience and provide flexible, affordable vacation options for a new generation of casual participants.
April 1, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 1st, 2026

The April 1st, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats featured industry experts Phil Ingrassia, Scott Bahr, and Simon Neal discussing how steady consumer sentiment and the therapeutic nature of the outdoors are sustaining the industry despite rising gas prices and geopolitical tensions. The panel explored the resilience of RVers and the potential for American campgrounds to adopt European-style “all-inclusive” resort models to attract a more diverse range of guests.
March 4, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – March 4th, 2026

Industry experts on MC Fireside Chats analyzed 2026 data trends, highlighting a shift toward shorter booking windows and the untapped potential of dynamic pricing to stabilize revenue despite “mild” transient growth. The panel emphasized that maintaining operational excellence and clear digital communication is essential for navigating current economic fluctuations and ensuring long-term resilience in the outdoor hospitality sector
February 4, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – February 4th, 2026

In the recent episode of MC Fireside Chats aired on February 4th, 2026, host Brian Searl and a panel of experts analyzed the shifting landscape of outdoor hospitality, noting a positive uptick in early-season booking pace and a stronger consumer sentiment compared to previous years. The discussion centered on a comprehensive new report regarding Gen Z, identifying them as a risk-averse, “experience-chasing” demographic that requires highly authentic digital storytelling and multi-channel marketing to engage effectively.

Recurring Guests

Scott Bahr

Scott Bahr

Cairn Consulting Group
Simon Neal

Simon Neal

CampMap
Miguel Huerta

Miguel Huerta

Mexican Glamping Association
Rafael Correa

Rafael Correa

Blue Water Development
Eleonore Hamm

Eleonore Hamm

RVDA Canada
Phil Ingrassia

Phil Ingrassia

RVDA
Michael Moore

Michael Moore

Texas Association of Campground Owners (TACO)

Week 2 - Building Park Value

The second Wednesday of the month focuses on how to build and evaluate park equity physically, operationally, and financially. With insights from designers, operational experts, active park owners, and valuation specialists, this episode covers physical master planning, strategic amenity investments, revenue generation, market valuation, and how to maximize the price your property commands when it’s time to sell.

December 10, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – December 10th, 2025

The panel discussed the evolving landscape of guest experiences, focusing on the opportunities in winter camping and the delicate balance between providing a rustic escape and modern connectivity. They emphasized that since most guests travel locally, parks should prioritize direct bookings and customer relationship management to build loyalty and reduce costs.
November 12, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – November 12th, 2025

The November 12 episode of MC Fireside Chats, broadcast live from the OHI booth at the 2025 OHCE Conference in Louisville, Kentucky, brought together industry leaders to discuss the state of outdoor hospitality, the role of AI, and pricing strategies amid changing market dynamics. Panelists shared personal insights, highlighted the value of networking and innovation, and looked ahead to continued industry growth with OHI announcing its next conference in Fort Worth, Texas.
October 8, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – October 8th, 2025

The episode featured MC Fireside Chats host Brian Searl and recurring guest Scott Foos (Horizon Outdoor Hospitality), joined by special guest Stephanie Kichler (Basecamp 37) for a deep dive into the glamping industry, focusing on the importance of personalized guest experience at independent, off-grid properties, while also discussing the market impact of the Glamping Show and Marriott’s new Outdoor Collection.
September 10, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – September 10th, 2025

On September 10, 2025, Zach Stoltenberg guest-hosted the MC Fireside Chats, featuring a panel of glamping and outdoor hospitality experts, including Dawn Farnworth, owner of By the Wye in Wales, and Chang Liang, managing partner at Collective Acre in Texas. The episode focused on glamping business models, the importance of guest experience, and the strategic use of technology to enhance operations and guest retention.
August 13, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – August 13th, 2025

The latest MC Fireside Chats episode featured a lively discussion with glamping entrepreneurs Brian and Ann Konradi of The Yurtopian, industry experts, and technology partners, centering on the importance of unique guest experiences, targeted marketing, and building customer loyalty. The conversation also touched on trends in outdoor hospitality, the balance between technology and personal touch, and the Konradis’ unique decision to raffle off one of their properties.
July 9, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – July 9th, 2025

In the July 9th, 2025 episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl and sponsored by Horizon Outdoor Hospitality, a diverse panel of guests discussed key trends and challenges in the outdoor hospitality industry. The recurring guests included Zach Stoltenberg from LJA and Casey Cochran from Campspot, joined by special guests Natalie Binder from Camp V and Josh Hansen and Rebecca Lindblom from Big Rock Creek. The discussion opened with introductions, where Casey Cochran highlighted Campspot’s role as an online reservation and property management system, emphasizing their marketplace for campers. Zach Stoltenberg, an architect, explained LJA Engineering’s work in designing and funding glamping and outdoor hospitality projects, noting he was joining from his cabin in Colorado with a view of Pikes Peak. Natalie Binder then introduced Camp V, a boutique glamping hotel in a restored historic mining town in Colorado, offering a mix of accommodations and an arts nonprofit for events. Josh Hansen described Big Rock Creek, a large glampground and event venue in Wisconsin, detailing their diverse glamping and camping options, alongside a barn for weddings and large events. Rebecca Lindblom, Josh’s sister, also from Big Rock Creek, later joined the conversation, elaborating on their successful Christmas Light Festival. A significant portion of the chat focused on the holiday weekend performance and revenue management. Casey Cochran reported that many campgrounds achieved 100% occupancy over the Fourth of July, highlighting Campspot’s efforts to automate revenue management by analyzing market and historical data. Brian Searl added that even with fewer camper nights, effective Average Daily Rate (ADR) management could still lead to increased revenue, potentially reducing guest issues. The conversation then shifted to disaster preparedness and emergency response, prompted by Zach Stoltenberg’s discussion of recent flooding in Texas that impacted summer camps and RV parks. He underscored the critical importance of having and practicing a disaster plan, citing a camp that avoided casualties due to robust planning. Natalie Binder shared her own harrowing experience with an electrical fire at Camp V, emphasizing that while they had plans, the actual employee reaction during an emergency is unpredictable and highlighted the need for more psychological and trauma-informed training. She also mentioned their strategy of bringing in trusted “outside contractors” for emergency coverage. Zach Stoltenberg suggested drawing lessons from amusement parks and cruise ships that conduct regular, unannounced drills. Josh Hansen acknowledged the difficulty of consistent training due to seasonal staff turnover. When asked about technological solutions, Casey Cochran noted Campspot’s dashboards could identify occupied sites, and while text messaging is useful, legal opt-in requirements limit its immediate impact in emergencies. Zach Stoltenberg also mentioned integrated hardware systems like Point Central that can automate alerts and controls within units. Ultimately, the consensus was that operators should at least start with a basic plan and rehearse it with their staff. The discussion transitioned to diversifying revenue and event-based marketing. Josh Hansen shared Big Rock Creek’s pivot to camping and glamping during COVID-19, accelerating their event business. Rebecca Lindblom highlighted their hugely successful Miracle at Big Rock Christmas Light Festival, which draws tens of thousands of visitors and effectively generates winter revenue while promoting summer offerings. She advised other operators to focus on efficient resourcing and creating social media-shareable photo opportunities. Natalie Binder revealed that Camp V’s Planet V Fest music festival also grew organically from guest enthusiasm and serves as a powerful marketing tool. She also shared how a $2 million state grant helped them build a new event pavilion. Natalie emphasized that for remote destinations like Camp V, relationship marketing and outbound efforts to attract specific groups are crucial, leveraging the property’s unique assets like dark skies. Both Josh Hansen and Natalie Binder agreed on the unpredictable but valuable nature of influencer marketing. Zach Stoltenberg observed that both Big Rock Creek and Camp V exemplify a business model where experiences and events are primary, with accommodations serving as a secondary component. This approach, he noted, naturally leads to higher revenues and creates lifelong customers. Rebecca Lindblom enthusiastically agreed, stating that event attendees often become repeat guests for all their offerings. Brian Searl concluded that prioritizing the experience generally works more in an operator’s favor. Zach Stoltenberg further distinguished the marketing channels for events (targeting HR directors, wedding planners) versus individual accommodation bookings. Natalie Binder reiterated that their success largely comes from grassroots, word-of-mouth, and direct relationship-building. In closing, Brian Searl thanked the guests. Natalie Binder encouraged visits to campv.com. Josh Hansen directed listeners to bigrockcreekwi.com and miracleatbigrock.com, adding a final thought that early-week glamping or camping can be just as enjoyable as weekends. Rebecca Lindblom also expressed appreciation for the discussion. Zach Stoltenberg highlighted the importance of relationships as a wise business strategy, where trust and connection naturally lead to strong business. Brian Searl then promoted his upcoming podcast, “The Campground of the Future,” before concluding the episode.
June 11, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – June 11th, 2025

On the June 11th, 2025, episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl of Insider Perks and Modern Campground led a vibrant discussion with a panel of industry experts on the evolving landscape of outdoor hospitality. The conversation delved into crucial topics ranging from the practicalities of developing off-grid glamping sites to the profound importance of curating a transformative guest experience. The episode brought together recurring panelists and special guests, each offering unique perspectives from their respective corners of the industry, creating a comprehensive overview of current trends, challenges, and opportunities. The show welcomed back its knowledgeable recurring guests, who consistently provide valuable insights. Scott Foos, representing Horizon Outdoor Hospitality, a third-party management and consulting firm, offered his analysis on market trends and operational strategies. Zach Stoltenberg of LJA, a multidisciplinary design firm, shared his expertise on the planning and design of outdoor resorts. Joe Duemig, the owner of App My Community, brought his perspective on technology and guest communication within campgrounds and resorts. Joining the panel were two special guests, both operators of distinctive Canadian glamping properties. Elizabeth McIntosh, the co-founder of Back Forty Glamping in Ontario, provided a look into the world of creating a luxury, four-season dome resort from the ground up. Also featured was Sarah Cruse, the General Manager of the remote and exclusive Clayoquot Wilderness Lodge on Vancouver Island, who shared her passion for creating deeply restorative and nature-based experiences for guests. The conversation kicked off with Zach Stoltenberg identifying a significant industry trend: the increasing client demand for off-grid and remote resort sites. He explained this push is driven by both the economic desire to avoid costly infrastructure development and the experiential appeal of secluded locations. Zach highlighted innovative solutions like those from Electric Outdoors, a company producing self-contained units with their own power and water systems, which could revolutionize how operators utilize undeveloped land and create unique, low-impact accommodations. Responding to the off-grid theme, Sarah Cruse detailed the operations of Clayoquot Wilderness Lodge, a property that has successfully operated off-grid for 25 years. She explained how the resort, accessible only by floatplane or boat, is a self-contained village that recently invested in British Columbia’s largest solar panel installation to harness the power of nature. Sarah’s story underscored the immense appeal and viability of such ventures but also served as a caution, noting that the “wild west” era of development has passed and that securing permits for such a project today would be incredibly challenging. Elizabeth McIntosh of Back Forty Glamping echoed the sentiment regarding regulatory hurdles, sharing her own complex journey with permitting in Ontario. She explained how the process of trying to fit their unique dome structures into existing, conventional building codes ultimately shaped their business model, forcing them to pivot to a higher-end, luxury offering to justify the extensive investment in infrastructure like a massive septic system. Her experience illustrated a common struggle for innovators in the glamping space and highlighted how external constraints can define a brand’s niche. A significant portion of the discussion was dedicated to the art and importance of the guest experience, a topic Sarah Cruse spoke about with palpable passion. She described her role as stewarding a “heart property” where the goal is to facilitate a “transformational state” in guests by disconnecting them from devices and reconnecting them with nature and each other. She emphasized that true hospitality is “heart-forward,” starting with a happy, engaged staff who genuinely care, which in turn creates an authentic and emotionally resonant experience for the guest. Scott Foos provided a broader market context to the importance of guest experience, sharing observations from a recent tour of over 50 properties across four states. He noted a softening in transient demand and a subsequent pivot by many operators toward chasing extended-stay business. His key finding was that properties demonstrating “intentionality”—those with thoughtful theming, clean aesthetics, visible staff, and a focus on creating a special atmosphere—were significantly outperforming their more generic neighbors, even those located right next door. Offering an international perspective, Joe Duemig recounted his recent trip to Australia for caravan industry shows. He observed a different business landscape, with a prevalence of marketing groups that parks belong to, as opposed to the more common franchise models in North America. He noted differences in pricing and amenity focus, providing a valuable comparison of how the industry operates in another part of the world and highlighting the global nature of outdoor travel. In his final thoughts, Scott Foos shared critical data on the American traveler, noting that while the desire for travel remains high, budget constraints are significant, with the average family having around $5,500 for the entire year. He argued that this economic reality uniquely positions the outdoor hospitality industry to provide value. However, he stressed that now is the time to double down on providing exceptional experiences to retain the core camping audience and continually remind them of the unique value and joy that camping provides. Ultimately, the episode underscored that success in the modern outdoor hospitality industry is a holistic endeavor. It requires navigating practical challenges like permitting and infrastructure, embracing innovation in accommodations, and, most importantly, cultivating an authentic and emotionally intelligent guest experience. The insights from Brian Searl, Scott Foos, Zach Stoltenberg, Joe Duemig, Elizabeth McIntosh, and Sarah Cruse painted a clear picture of an industry where those who focus on the details and lead with heart are best positioned to thrive.
May 14, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – May 14th, 2025

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl of Insider Perks kicked off the conversation by lightheartedly addressing his scratchy voice and acknowledging the absence of several regular panelists, including Joe Duemig, who was attending a conference in Australia, Scott Foos, who had a meeting, and Kevin Thueson, who was traveling. Despite these absences, Searl enthusiastically introduced the two featured guests: John Handy, co-owner of Treebones Resort, and Devon Towle, Founder and CEO of Global Glamping, also known as Sir Glamps-a-lot. John Handy shared the 20-year journey of establishing Treebones Resort in Big Sur with his wife Corinne. He recounted the serendipitous rezoning of their oceanfront property to commercial use and their subsequent decade-long exploration of creating a unique lodging experience. Handy explained that the concept of “glamping” didn’t even exist when they began, but their vision was to offer an experience that combined the closeness to nature of camping with the comforts of a hotel, leading them to discover yurts. He highlighted the significant financial risks they undertook with business and construction loans, contrasting their approach with the revenue-sharing models discussed later. Handy emphasized that the success of Treebones lies in its unique location, the dedicated on-site staff, and the array of amenities, including fine dining with a sushi bar and lodge restaurant, massage, yoga, a pool, spa, and jacuzzi, all while maintaining a low carbon footprint. Devon Towle, or Sir Glamps-a-lot, detailed his entrepreneurial journey, starting from a background in architecture and housing consultation to founding Global Glamping. He shared how his initial foray into glamping began with a single yurt on raw land in Montana, which surprisingly led to recognition as one of the best Hipcamps in the state. This experience highlighted the potential of the industry and the need for guidance, prompting him to establish Global Glamping. Towle proudly mentioned the company’s growth to 15 resorts with over a hundred short-term rentals and their specialization in eco-tourism development. He was particularly excited to be calling in from their Guardian Ranch location in San Diego, showcasing 3D-printed tiny houses from Azure Printed Homes, emphasizing the rapid construction and eco-friendly nature of these units made from recycled materials. The conversation then shifted to the topic of bootstrapping versus seeking investment capital. Towle shared his experience of creatively financing his ventures, including a “Glamping Rev Share” model that allowed him to partner with landowners and structure providers. He emphasized that the barrier to entry in glamping can be significantly lower than traditional real estate investments, allowing entrepreneurs to start with modest means and grow creatively. Searl resonated with this, sharing his own experiences of building his business without significant initial investment and highlighting the flexibility and potential rewards of a bootstrapped approach. Both Handy and Towle agreed on the importance of agility and the ability to pivot in business. Handy used a compelling ship analogy, stating that a ship in a harbor is safe but not fulfilling its purpose, and that forward motion is necessary for steering. He shared examples of unforeseen challenges like road closures and economic shifts that require constant adaptation. Towle echoed this, emphasizing that nothing ever goes exactly to plan and that perseverance and the willingness to pivot are crucial for entrepreneurs in the often unpredictable world of eco-tourism and glamping. The discussion touched upon the role of technology in their businesses. Handy highlighted how Starlink internet and advancements in battery storage systems have been game-changers for Treebones, especially given their off-grid location. He also spoke about their adoption of Azure 3D-printed homes as an eco-conscious lodging option. Towle also emphasized the speed to market and cost-effectiveness of the 3D-printed homes. Both expressed excitement about future technological advancements, including the potential of AI in design and 3D printing. Searl raised the topic of disconnecting in a hyper-connected world, sharing his own recent experience of the benefits of unplugging. Handy recounted a story about the Wall Street Journal inquiring about their “prepare to unplug” message from their early days, noting the initial resistance from some guests but also the eventual appreciation for the opportunity to disconnect. He mentioned that while technology has advanced at Treebones, they still maintain areas where guests can intentionally unplug. Looking towards the future, Handy expressed that Treebones Resort would remain family-owned and operated, with the next generation taking on leadership roles. He emphasized their commitment to maintaining the essence of Treebones – perching lightly on the land, living simply, and connecting with nature – even as they evolve. Towle shared his vision for Global Glamping, aiming to create affordable, eco-friendly living communities and develop a gamified app to enhance the ecotourism experience. He expressed a long-term goal of securing larger-scale funding to expand these communities for midterm and long-term living, promoting a lifestyle connected to nature and entrepreneurship. In closing, Searl expressed his admiration for the work of both Handy and Towle, predicting a bright future for their ventures and the eco-tourism industry as a whole. He underscored the power of inspiring others through their innovative approaches to hospitality and sustainable living.
April 9, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – April 9th, 2025

This MC Fireside Chats episode on April 9th, 2025, hosted by Brian Searl from Insider Perks, brought together a panel of experts to discuss the current state and future trends of the outdoor hospitality industry. The recurring guests, Joe Duemig, the owner and founder of App My Community, a company specializing in mobile apps for campground guest engagement and communication, and Kevin Thueson, a partner at KCN Campgrounds, a real estate investment firm operating a portfolio of nine KOA franchise parks, were joined by special guests Lucy Comer, the co-owner and founder of Hadspen Glamping, an off-grid glamping site in Southwest England, and Jen Rice, the general manager at Empire Recreation Management and WhoaZone, which develops water-based family entertainment centers. The central theme of the discussion revolved around the anticipated impact of the prevailing economic uncertainty and the rapidly evolving sociopolitical landscape on camper behavior in the 2025 season. Brian Searl initiated the conversation by referencing early data that suggested an uptick in reservations for early 2025 compared to the previous year. However, this optimistic outlook was immediately challenged by Kevin Thueson, who reported seeing a contrary trend within KCN Campgrounds, with reservations currently lagging behind the same period last year. He attributed this hesitancy among travelers to the continued uncertainty stemming from various factors, including the recent election and ongoing rapid changes. Joe Duemig offered a more nuanced perspective, suggesting that the impact of these uncertainties would likely vary significantly depending on the specific characteristics of individual campgrounds. He posited that factors such as the type of park (e.g., destination-focused versus en-route stops) and its geographical location would play a crucial role in determining its resilience. He voiced particular concern for campgrounds that heavily cater to snowbirds and those with a significant portion of their clientele coming from Canada, given the existing political tensions and reported decrease in border crossings. While acknowledging the historical trend of campgrounds performing well during economic downturns as a more affordable travel option, Joe Duemig cautioned that the recent increase in campground rates might alter this dynamic. He advised campground owners to proactively develop backup plans to mitigate potential negative impacts. Kevin Thueson further elaborated on the booking trends, suggesting that the current situation might not necessarily indicate a crisis but rather a reversion to pre-pandemic travel patterns. He recalled that before the surge in early and extended bookings during COVID-19, the majority of reservations were typically made much closer to the stay date. He also pointed out the significant decline in international travel since the onset of the pandemic and the slow pace of its recovery, which could influence the impact of current international travel advisories. He emphasized the importance of differentiating between overnight or journey-style parks, which traditionally experience slower reservation pick-up, and destination parks that often see bookings well in advance. Shifting the focus to the UK market, Lucy Comer provided an insightful perspective from Hadspen Glamping. She reported a substantial cost of living crisis in the UK, which has influenced travel patterns. Interestingly, despite this economic pressure, their bookings for April were double compared to the same month in the previous year. However, she also noted a clear trend of people opting for more local vacations and a significant decrease in international travel to their site. Lucy Comer highlighted that Hadspen Glamping’s success lies in offering a unique experience centered around sustainability, its off-grid nature, and its deep connection with the local environment and suppliers. She emphasized that they are selling an escape and an experience rather than simply accommodation. The conversation then transitioned to strategies for enhancing the guest experience. Kevin Thueson underscored the critical role of exceptional hospitality and actively engaging with guests as a key differentiator, particularly for campgrounds that might not have the newest facilities. He suggested practical ways to elevate the guest experience, such as organizing tournaments and events around existing amenities like mini-golf or newly added pickleball courts. Joe Duemig, drawing from his extensive travel experiences with his large family, echoed the sentiment about the importance of friendly and attentive customer service. He shared positive anecdotes from campgrounds that went the extra mile, such as offering free water sports equipment, proactively providing assistance, and offering small but impactful gestures like welcome drinks for adults and children. Jen Rice introduced WhoaZone, explaining its mission to revitalize existing bodies of water in various settings by installing inflatable water-based attractions for family entertainment. She emphasized the goal of encouraging outdoor recreation and providing an immersive and thrilling experience for guests, whether they are staying at a partnering campground or visiting for the day. Jen Rice highlighted that WhoaZone’s unique selling proposition is their deep operational experience, as they not only provide the equipment but also manage and operate the attractions, bringing a practical, on-the-ground perspective to their clients. Finally, the discussion touched upon the future of the industry, particularly concerning sustainability and the adoption of new technologies like electric vehicle (EV) charging stations. Lucy Comer discussed the challenges of implementing EV charging at an off-grid glamping site and the importance of ensuring that any technological additions are both effective and user-friendly for guests. Kevin Thueson provided a pragmatic view on investing in EV infrastructure, emphasizing the need to balance the potential demand with the financial implications for investors and the rapidly evolving nature of the technology. He suggested a cautious approach, monitoring the actual demand and the technological advancements before making significant capital investments, as overspending based on speculation could be risky. In conclusion, Brian Searl thanked the insightful panel for their contributions, providing listeners with contact information for Hadspen Glamping (hadspenglamping.co.uk), App My Community (appmycommunity.com), and WhoaZone (gowhoazone.com). He announced the upcoming Outwired podcast episode, promising further data-driven discussions on consumer behavior in the outdoor hospitality sector.

Recurring Guests

Tom Mason, IVEE Group

Tom Mason

IVEE Group
Zach Stoltenberg, Clockwork

Zach Stoltenberg

Clockwork

Landan Dory

North Star Brokerage & Advisory

Jayne Cohen, Campground Consulting Group

Jayne Cohen

Campground Consulting Group

Scott Foos, Horizon Outdoor Hospitality

Scott Foos

Horizon Outdoor Hospitality
Jeremy Johnson, Kona Hills Campground

Jeremy Johnson

Kona Hills Campground
Kaleigh Day, Surf Junction Campground

Kaleigh Day

Surf Junction Campground

Week 3 - Business Operations and Management

On the third Wednesday, we tackle the operational side of running a successful campground. This episode features operations consultants and experts discussing strategies for staff management, technology integration, and maintaining profitability while navigating challenges.

September 16, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 16th, 2026

During the September 19, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, insurance and outdoor hospitality experts emphasized that combating rising premiums and frivolous lawsuits requires operators to strictly enforce liability waivers, maintain pristine safety records, and secure specialized policies to protect their long-term profitability.
August 19, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – August 19th, 2026

During this episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts emphasized that to survive rising interest rates and a post-COVID refinancing squeeze, campground owners must move away from generic operations and rigorously target a specific ideal customer profile to maintain profitability and secure strong property valuations.
July 15, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 15th, 2026

During the July 15, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts emphasized the critical need for versatility in outdoor hospitality by exploring long-term tax strategies, the debate between market oversupply and camper affordability, and the strategic value of incorporating tent sites and glamping to drive future growth.
June 17, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – June 17th, 2026

In the June 17, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts discussed the launch of a new outdoor hospitality data dashboard, the operational benefits of solid-wall yurt cabins, and the need for campgrounds to prepare for upcoming electrical code changes affecting RV pedestals.
May 20, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – May 20th, 2026

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl interviews newcomer campground owner Jon Thatcher, exploring how modern operators can revitalize the outdoor hospitality industry by lowering barriers for younger generations, embracing premium glamping experiences, and utilizing innovative technology.
April 15, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 15th, 2026

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl, Robert Preston, Angele Miller, and Cody Fall discuss the rapid professionalization of the campground industry, ranging from the operational hurdles of managing dozens of properties to the successful integration of high-end wellness amenities. The group emphasizes that while scaling and technology are essential for growth, the core of their success lies in understanding shifting traveler demographics and revitalizing aging infrastructure to preserve the outdoor experience for future generations.
March 18, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – March 18th, 2026

In this MC Fireside Chats episode, industry experts discuss how campground operators can navigate economic shifts by focusing on data-driven management and resolving operational bottlenecks like poor customer service. They also debate the delicate balance between adopting new technologies, such as digital check-ins, and maintaining the essential human element of outdoor hospitality.
February 18, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – February 18th, 2026

Host Brian Searl and industry experts Mike Harrison, Robert Preston, Sandy Ellingson, and Jeff Hoffman discussed the current economic cycle of the outdoor hospitality industry, focusing on market corrections and the importance of professional property management. The episode featured special guest Saurav Ghosal of Sojourn Lodging, who received strategic mentorship on rebranding, navigating seasonal occupancy shifts, and transitioning from an “outdoor hotel” identity to a defined glamping experience.
January 21, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – January 21st, 2026

Host Brian Searl leads a panel of industry experts and special guests from Daiva RV Resorts and Let’s Camp to discuss the 2026 outlook, debating the contrast between optimistic RV show attendance and the reality of normalizing booking windows and occupancy. The conversation further explores strategies for aligning state and national associations for better advocacy, balancing corporate efficiency with family-centric hospitality, and the increasing necessity of leveraging AI and data analytics in outdoor recreation.

Recurring Guests

Jeff Hoffman, Camp Strategy

Jeff Hoffman

Camp Strategy
Sandy Ellingson, RV Industry Advisor

Sandy Ellingson

RV Industry Advisor
Mike Harrison, CRR Hospitality

Mike Harrison

CRR Hospitality
Angele Miller, Creekside RnR Glamping

Angele Miller

Creekside RnR Glamping
Robert Preston, Unhitched Management

Robert Preston

Unhitched Management
Casey Cochran, Campspot

Casey Cochran

Campspot
John McMahon, Camp Door County RV Resort & Campground

John McMahon

Camp Door County RV Resort & Campground

Week 4 - Marketing, AI, and Technology

The fourth Wednesday of the month covers the latest tools and marketing strategies driving innovation in outdoor hospitality. Guests include marketing pros, AI experts, and tech providers exploring personalized marketing, smart technologies, digital engagement, and data-driven operations.

September 23, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 23rd, 2026

During the September 23, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts emphasized that campground operators should embrace artificial intelligence to automate backend data and marketing workflows, ultimately saving time and boosting revenue while keeping the technology invisible to preserve genuine, human-to-human hospitality.
August 26, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – August 26th, 2026

During the latest episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts agreed that while the rapid evolution of artificial intelligence and its use in marketing continues to spark debates over authenticity, its greatest value in outdoor hospitality lies in automating backend operations so staff can focus on delivering exceptional, human-to-human guest experiences.
June 24, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – June 24th, 2026

In the June 24, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts Matt Whitermore, Scott Lengel, and Craig Alsup discussed the urgent need for campground owners to embrace artificial intelligence and smart technologies. The panel highlighted how economic pressures and evolving consumer expectations are making digital innovation and operational efficiency essential for long-term survival in the outdoor hospitality market.
May 27, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – May 27th, 2026

In the May 27, 2026 episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl, Cara Csizmadia, and Amber Simpson discussed the urgent need for campgrounds to adopt AI and adapt to changing Google search behaviors despite valid environmental reservations. The panel also emphasized that leaning on hyper-local marketing strategies and trusted industry partners is essential for operators to successfully navigate current economic headwinds and lower transient occupancy rates.
April 22, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 22nd, 2026

In the recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, Brian Searl and his guests discuss how AI serves as an invisible intelligence layer to improve park efficiency and guest personalization. They conclude that the technology’s true value lies in automating the back office so that staff can focus entirely on providing an authentic human experience in nature.
March 25, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – March 25th, 2026

The episode featured Brian Searl, Peter Pilarski, and Mike Lee discussing how AI and shifting search behaviors are transforming discovery and marketing for campground owners and tourism operators, with Peter advocating for “digital authority” through structured website content, schema markup, and entity consistency, while Mike shared how restructuring data on his Campsite Tonight app’s pages tripled his search impressions. All three agreed that small business owners should start with practical steps like optimizing their Google Business Profile and answering real traveler questions on their websites, focusing on one priority at a time rather than trying to tackle everything at once.
February 25, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – February 25th, 2026

Host Brian Searl led a discussion on the rapid evolution of AI agents and “dark factory” patterns with experts Matt Whitermore, Kurtis Wilkins, Cara Csizmadia, and Patrick Mullen. The panel explored how these technologies are revolutionizing campground operations and digital marketing, emphasizing that even non-technical operators can now leverage high-speed AI tools to build custom software and optimize guest acquisition strategies.
January 28, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – January 28th, 2026

In a session focused on the future of outdoor hospitality, host Brian Searl and industry experts discussed how AI and automation are being used to streamline operations and enhance the guest experience. The panel emphasized that while technology handles backend efficiency and data-driven tasks, the primary goal remains freeing up staff to provide a more personalized, human touch for campers.
November 26, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – November 26th, 2025

The November 26th episode of MC Fireside Chats featured an in-depth discussion on the accelerating pace of AI, sparked by the new Gemini 3.0 model and the US government’s “Genesis Mission,” with host Brian Searl and guests Kurtis Wilkins, Matt Whitermore, Cara Csizmadia, and special guest Lizzy Bustamante. The panel explored how AI is transforming business operations and slowing job growth, stressing that the outdoor hospitality industry must leverage these tools to enhance the crucial, human-centric guest experience rather than fearing the technological shift.

Recurring Guests

Mychele Bisson, Bison Peak Ventures

Mychele Bisson

Bison Peak Ventures
Cara Csizmadia, Canadian Camping & RV Association

Cara Csizmadia

Canadian Camping & RV Association
Matt Whittemore, Climb Capital

Matt Whittemore

Climb Capital
Ravi Parikh, RoverPass

Ravi Parikh

RoverPass
Sarah Stahl, Market Movers

Sarah Stahl

Market Movers

Week 5 - Multi-Sector Show

On the rare occasions when a month has a fifth Wednesday, we present a special multi-sector episode. This collaborative platform brings together a diverse panel of guests from the glamping, campground, RV, outdoor recreation, and activities industries. The rich discussion fosters a multifaceted understanding, offering varied perspectives and insights from across these sectors.

September 30, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 30th, 2026

During the September 30, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, property operators Stephanie Bias and Munro Murdock emphasized that the future of outdoor hospitality relies on blending invisible backend technology with highly curated, generation-specific guest experiences—ranging from luxury all-inclusive glamping to diverse, nature-focused hybrid parks.
July 29, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 29th, 2026

Industry experts on the July 29th MC Fireside Chats emphasized that hospitality operators must first document their internal workflows to successfully adopt AI and digital tools, enabling them to streamline operations, personalize guest experiences, and increase profitability without losing the essential human touch.
April 29, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 29th, 2026

Host Brian Searl and a panel of outdoor hospitality experts—including Marie Nichols, Duncan Winship, and Ashley Cary—discussed how international travel apps, changing generational preferences, and data-driven marketing are transforming the modern camping industry.
October 29, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – October 29th, 2025

The latest MC Fireside Chats episode focused on how glamping operators are revolutionizing outdoor hospitality by prioritizing unique, high-touch guest experiences and personal connection, demonstrating that success in the industry, regardless of scale or location, relies on moving beyond simple accommodation.
July 30, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – July 30th, 2025

In this special fifth week episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl welcomes three glamping pioneers—from the UK to Costa Rica—for a global look at the evolving outdoor hospitality landscape. The guests dive into everything from guest engagement and winter operations to marketing challenges, AI, and the future of glamping.
April 30, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – April 30th, 2025

The MC Fireside Chats episode on April 30th, 2025, began with host Brian Searl acknowledging technical difficulties at the start of the show. Brian then introduced the guests: Mychele Bisson, Mary Sparrow, and Heidi Royle, each bringing a unique perspective on the outdoor hospitality industry. Mychele Bisson shared her work with Bison Peak Ventures, acquiring campgrounds across the country, revitalizing them, and aiming to preserve the original family’s legacy. She emphasized the importance of maintaining the essence of these establishments while introducing modern improvements. Mary Sparrow discussed her ownership of a boatyard in the east of England and her innovative approach to hospitality with floating glamping pods. Her business evolved from traditional houseboats to unique, luxury floating accommodations, offering guests a distinctive experience on the water. Heidi Royle detailed her journey of establishing the Groove Glamping, a glamping site in Minnesota, located near a state park. She highlighted the natural attractions of the area, such as the clear water creeks and the state park, which enhance the appeal of her glamping site. The discussion then shifted to the concept of “glamping,” with various perspectives on its definition and evolution. The guests explored how glamping has changed over time, influenced by social media and the increasing demand for unique outdoor experiences. The challenges and strategies of promoting and operating glamping sites were also discussed. Heidi Royle shared her experience with influencer collaborations to increase awareness of the Grove Glamping. Mary Sparrow provided insights into the complexities of running a business that combines traditional boating with modern glamping. This included the unique considerations for floating accommodations and the importance of preserving the natural environment. Mychele Bisson spoke about Bison Peak Ventures’ business model of acquiring and upgrading campgrounds, emphasizing the rewarding aspect of providing families with opportunities to connect and create memories in nature. A significant part of the conversation focused on the personal fulfillment derived from operating these businesses. The guests shared stories of the joy and satisfaction that comes from seeing families and children enjoy the outdoors, away from the distractions of modern technology. The episode concluded with the guests sharing their final thoughts and where to find more information about their businesses. The overarching theme was the value of creating unique outdoor experiences and the positive impact these experiences have on individuals and families.
January 29, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – January 29th, 2025

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl welcomed Josef Hjelmaker, CEO of Electric Outdoors, Robert Preston, CEO and Founder of Unhitched Management, and Matt and Karina Torres, owners of Bayshore RV Park, to discuss their experiences and insights into the outdoor hospitality and RV park industries. The conversation covered everything from business growth and sustainability to unique guest experiences and the future of the industry. Robert Preston shared his journey from a military pilot to a real estate investor, now owning 14 RV parks through Climb Capital and Unhitched Management. His focus is on fostering a sense of community within his parks, providing spaces where guests can disconnect from daily life and reconnect with nature and each other. He emphasized the importance of safe, clean, and welcoming environments in creating a successful RV park experience. His management philosophy revolves around treating employees well so they, in turn, provide exceptional hospitality to guests. He also spoke about his approach to acquiring and scaling parks, explaining that his growth is based on finding good deals while ensuring that each new acquisition enhances the efficiency and effectiveness of his existing properties. Josef Hjelmaker introduced Electric Outdoors, a company focused on sustainability and innovation in outdoor hospitality. His company develops portable, self-sustaining destination platforms that generate their own energy, manage water, and handle waste independently. The units, designed to be placed in remote or off-grid locations, offer a new way to camp without requiring traditional infrastructure or permits. He explained how these platforms provide flexibility for landowners and park operators, allowing them to create new camping experiences in places previously inaccessible to RVs and traditional campers. The conversation also touched on the growing role of electric vehicles in outdoor recreation, with Josef discussing how his technology supports off-grid stays while accommodating the needs of EV travelers. He highlighted the importance of digital integration, explaining how his platforms use connectivity to enhance user experience through booking, energy management, and local activity recommendations. Matt and Karina Torres shared their experience of acquiring and revitalizing Bayshore RV Park on the Washington coast. Their journey began when Matt, a former framer and general contractor, and Karina, with a background in property management, combined their skills to turn their park into a thriving business. They emphasized the importance of hands-on management, directly engaging with guests to provide personalized service and a welcoming atmosphere. They spoke about their approach to balancing long-term and transient guests, their focus on creating unique experiences such as easy access to crabbing in Willapa Bay, and their strategy for reinvesting profits back into the park. They also discussed their long-term goal of eventually hiring a dedicated manager so they can expand to additional properties while ensuring their guests continue to receive the same level of care and hospitality. The discussion highlighted the changing landscape of the outdoor hospitality industry and the increasing importance of offering more than just a place to stay. The guests agreed that creating meaningful experiences for visitors, whether through high-touch customer service, sustainable accommodations, or fostering a sense of community, is key to long-term success. Brian Searl noted that the industry has thrived for years with minimal effort due to economic conditions, but moving forward, park owners will need to be more intentional about guest experiences to maintain and grow their businesses. He pointed out that travelers are looking for something unique, and parks that can deliver on that will be the ones that stand out in an increasingly competitive market. The conversation also touched on the challenges and rewards of park ownership. Robert spoke about the balance between growth and operational efficiency, explaining that his goal is not just to acquire more properties but to ensure each park is well-run and financially sustainable. He emphasized the importance of hiring entrepreneurial-minded managers who treat the business as their own and make decisions that benefit both guests and ownership. Matt and Karina reflected on their initial struggles and learning experiences, including the realization that hiring the wrong staff can impact guest satisfaction. They shared how they adjusted their management approach to be more involved, ensuring that guests feel valued from the moment they arrive. As the discussion wrapped up, Brian announced the launch of a new podcast called Outwired, which will focus on data, AI, and technology in outdoor hospitality. The show will feature unfiltered discussions on industry trends, innovations, and challenges, with co-hosts Greg Emmert from Camp Strategy and Scott Bahr from Cairn Consulting Group. The episode ended with a shared enthusiasm for the future of the outdoor hospitality industry, with all guests expressing optimism about the opportunities ahead for park owners who are willing to innovate and prioritize guest experiences. The insights from this episode underscored the industry’s evolution, with sustainability, community-building, and technology playing a growing role in shaping the next generation of outdoor accommodations.
October 30, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – October 30th, 2024

In the October 30, 2024 episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl brings together several guests to explore various perspectives in outdoor hospitality and the RV industry. The episode features Ken Barber from Wild Haven Glamping, Leslie Taylor-Rharbi from Signature RV Resorts by Zeman, and Paul Craven and Anthony Wollschlager from Airxcel. Brian starts by introducing the guests, encouraging them to share insights about their companies and experiences. Leslie kicks things off by describing her role in managing Zeman’s luxury RV resorts, specifically the “Signature” line, known for providing high-end amenities and tailored experiences. She emphasizes that while they’ve moved away from labeling the resorts as “luxury,” Zeman’s properties continue to offer lush landscapes and a range of amenities like pickleball courts, large clubhouses, and lounges to enhance guest experiences. Ken shares the story of Wild Haven Glamping, discussing how his company provides a mid-tier glamping experience that strikes a balance between comfort and the rustic nature of camping. His properties feature canvas tents and small cabins in scenic locations like Sonoma County and Yosemite, emphasizing a natural and immersive experience over excessive luxury. Ken underscores the challenges they’ve faced, particularly in terms of permits, zoning, and construction, especially with their recent Yosemite property. Despite these hurdles, he and his team focus on delivering unique experiences that attract tourists from across the world. Leslie and Ken agree that evolving guest expectations shape their operations. Leslie notes that Zeman’s properties attract a retiree demographic who expect comfort and quality; however, the increasing demand for “luxury” resorts has redefined the standards of guest experiences, with visitors now expecting amenities akin to high-end hotels. Ken adds that Wild Haven’s guests are typically more open to a stripped-down luxury, opting for a unique natural experience over a traditionally luxurious one. They also touch on the importance of managing expectations through strategic language and marketing, emphasizing terms like “signature” instead of “luxury,” which sets an authentic tone that aligns with their guests’ values. The conversation then shifts to Airxcel, where Anthony and Paul discuss their roles in supplying RV components, such as air conditioners, water heaters, and ventilation systems, that enhance comfort for RV travelers. They explain that Airxcel has a long-standing history in Elkhart, Indiana, the “RV capital” of the U.S., providing essential products to RV manufacturers. Their focus on innovation helps the company anticipate trends, such as the rising demand for sustainable products and off-grid experiences. Paul emphasizes that Airxcel keeps a close watch on industry trends and consumer demands, aiming to deliver products that meet the evolving needs of RV enthusiasts, from full-time RVers to occasional campers. Anthony elaborates on the shift in RV ownership demographics since COVID-19, explaining how younger families and first-time RVers are increasingly investing in the lifestyle. With Airxcel’s established brands, such as Coleman air conditioners and Suburban water heaters, the company leverages its expertise to stay competitive and support new trends in the industry. Paul and Anthony both stress that consumer expectations are driving changes within the RV and camping sectors, where personalization, data-driven guest insights, and seamless technology integration are becoming essential for a superior experience. Brian also dives into potential future trends, sparking an engaging discussion on the influence of AI, automation, and personalization. The guests contemplate how new technology could transform both the outdoor hospitality and RV industries, with Brian suggesting that technology should serve to elevate the guest experience, not detract from it. Ken and Leslie agree, envisioning AI tools that could enable them to provide small, personalized touches, like welcome gifts and birthday recognition, that enhance customer satisfaction without feeling intrusive. Paul underscores the importance of AI in developing more sustainable RV solutions, citing the growing interest in systems that reduce energy use by automatically adjusting to guests’ schedules. Throughout the discussion, the guests emphasize the importance of clear expectations and strong branding. Ken and Leslie both prioritize aligning their offerings with guest expectations, ensuring that their brands promise experiences they can consistently deliver. By avoiding terms like “luxury” and “pampering” in their marketing, both Ken and Leslie are careful to set the right tone for their properties, allowing guests to feel comfortable and engaged in the outdoor experience. The episode concludes with the guests sharing where listeners can find more information about their companies and locations. Ken invites listeners to Wild Haven Glamping in Sonoma County or Yosemite to experience the beauty of Northern California. Leslie and the Airxcel team encourage interested listeners to explore Signature RV Resorts by Zeman and Airxcel’s various product offerings, respectively. The conversation wraps up on a note of optimism, with each guest expressing enthusiasm for the future of outdoor hospitality, the evolution of guest experiences, and the innovations likely to shape the industry in years to come.
July 31, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – July 31st, 2024 

In the July 31st episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, the discussion brought together Pier Tognazzini, founder and COO of MooVert France, and Dustin Sauer, owner of Overland Van Project, to delve into the evolving trends in outdoor hospitality, sustainable tourism, and the growing van life movement. Brian Searl kicked off the episode by acknowledging the uniqueness of the discussion, as it was one of those rare “fifth-week” episodes without the usual lineup of regular guests. Instead, this episode featured a deep dive into niche areas of outdoor hospitality, beginning with Pier Tognazzini. Pier introduced MooVert France, a company dedicated to promoting tourism in France through an eco-friendly and authentic lens. He emphasized MooVert France’s commitment to helping accommodations transition into more sustainable practices by using an algorithm that evaluates properties based on their level of eco-friendliness, sustainability, and authenticity. Pier explained that MooVert is not just about reducing environmental impact but also about offering tourists an experience that goes beyond the typical attractions, allowing them to connect deeply with local culture, heritage, and nature. He provided examples of how MooVert curates these experiences, such as offering stays in tree houses, tiny homes, and even traditional French chateaux. Pier also discussed how MooVert helps property owners make small but impactful changes, such as installing water-saving devices, to enhance sustainability without compromising guest comfort. The conversation also touched on the importance of authenticity, with Pier explaining that MooVert prioritizes experiences that allow travelers to engage with local traditions and communities, such as making cheese in Normandy or harvesting honey in the Alps. Dustin Sauer then introduced Overland Van Project, which specializes in creating high-end, custom expedition vehicles and camper vans designed for those seeking adventure and luxury on the road. Dustin shared the origins of his company, which began as a personal project but quickly grew into a thriving business as demand for custom vans surged during the pandemic. He highlighted how the van life movement, amplified by social media and the hashtag #vanlife, has evolved from a niche lifestyle into a significant trend within the outdoor industry. Dustin discussed the challenges and opportunities within the current market, noting that while there has been a plateau in demand following the pandemic boom, there is still a strong interest in high-quality, custom-built vans. He emphasized the importance of innovation and craftsmanship in differentiating Overland Van Project from other builders, with a focus on integrating advanced features such as hydronic heating systems, high-end electrical setups, and luxury finishes that cater to the specific needs of their clients. Despite the market becoming saturated with both DIY and commercially produced vans, Dustin remains optimistic, citing the enduring appeal of van life and the desire for off-the-grid, self-sufficient travel experiences. The conversation between the three touched on the intersection of sustainability and the outdoor lifestyle. Dustin noted that many of his clients, despite investing in luxury vans, prefer to camp in remote, free locations like BLM lands, rather than traditional RV resorts. This aligns with the growing trend towards authentic, nature-based experiences that Pier’s company, MooVert, also champions. The guests and Brian discussed how this shift reflects broader changes in consumer behavior, where travelers are increasingly seeking out unique and meaningful experiences rather than conventional tourist activities. A significant portion of the discussion was devoted to the challenges of marketing to niche audiences in a competitive landscape dominated by large platforms like Airbnb and Booking.com. Pier and Dustin both emphasized the importance of authenticity in their marketing efforts, whether through social media engagement or creating compelling content that resonates with their target audiences. They acknowledged the difficulties small businesses face in standing out, but also highlighted the potential of social media and viral content to level the playing field. Brian also brought up the role of artificial intelligence (AI) in helping small businesses enhance their marketing strategies and reach. He expressed optimism about how AI could assist companies like MooVert France and Overland Van Project in creating more tailored and effective marketing campaigns, thereby connecting with their niche audiences more efficiently. The episode wrapped up with final thoughts from Pier and Dustin on the future of their respective industries. Pier expressed enthusiasm about the potential expansion of MooVert France into North America, hinting at ongoing discussions with state governments in Nevada and California. Dustin, on the other hand, reiterated his commitment to pushing the boundaries of van design and continuing to provide exceptional, high-quality products for his clients. Overall, this episode of MC Fireside Chats provided a rich exploration of the current trends and future directions in outdoor hospitality, with a strong emphasis on sustainability, authenticity, and the evolving desires of modern travelers. The insights shared by Pier Tognazzini and Dustin Sauer offered valuable perspectives on how businesses can adapt and thrive in this dynamic and competitive industry.