Episodes

Week 1 - Industry Trends & Insights

Each first Wednesday of the month, we dive into the latest trends, market analysis, and predictions in the outdoor hospitality industry. Join industry analysts, market researchers, and outdoor hospitality industry leaders as they unpack topics like market growth, demographic changes, and guest preferences.

MC Fireside Chats logo
June 7, 2021

MC Fireside Chats – June 7th, 2021

In this episode, we discussed KOA’s latest real-time availability feature on their website, issues hiring employees, and much more. Special guests for this open discussion include Ryan Crots from Petoskey KOA Holiday in Michigan.

Recurring Guests

Scott Bahr

Scott Bahr

Cairn Consulting Group
Simon Neal

Simon Neal

CampMap
Miguel Huerta

Miguel Huerta

Mexican Glamping Association
Rafael Correa

Rafael Correa

Blue Water Development
Eleonore Hamm

Eleonore Hamm

RVDA Canada
Phil Ingrassia

Phil Ingrassia

RVDA
Michael Moore

Michael Moore

Texas Association of Campground Owners (TACO)

Week 2 - Building Park Value

The second Wednesday of the month focuses on how to build and evaluate park equity physically, operationally, and financially. With insights from designers, operational experts, active park owners, and valuation specialists, this episode covers physical master planning, strategic amenity investments, revenue generation, market valuation, and how to maximize the price your property commands when it’s time to sell.

December 10, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – December 10th, 2025

The panel discussed the evolving landscape of guest experiences, focusing on the opportunities in winter camping and the delicate balance between providing a rustic escape and modern connectivity. They emphasized that since most guests travel locally, parks should prioritize direct bookings and customer relationship management to build loyalty and reduce costs.
November 12, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – November 12th, 2025

The November 12 episode of MC Fireside Chats, broadcast live from the OHI booth at the 2025 OHCE Conference in Louisville, Kentucky, brought together industry leaders to discuss the state of outdoor hospitality, the role of AI, and pricing strategies amid changing market dynamics. Panelists shared personal insights, highlighted the value of networking and innovation, and looked ahead to continued industry growth with OHI announcing its next conference in Fort Worth, Texas.
October 8, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – October 8th, 2025

The episode featured MC Fireside Chats host Brian Searl and recurring guest Scott Foos (Horizon Outdoor Hospitality), joined by special guest Stephanie Kichler (Basecamp 37) for a deep dive into the glamping industry, focusing on the importance of personalized guest experience at independent, off-grid properties, while also discussing the market impact of the Glamping Show and Marriott’s new Outdoor Collection.
September 10, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – September 10th, 2025

On September 10, 2025, Zach Stoltenberg guest-hosted the MC Fireside Chats, featuring a panel of glamping and outdoor hospitality experts, including Dawn Farnworth, owner of By the Wye in Wales, and Chang Liang, managing partner at Collective Acre in Texas. The episode focused on glamping business models, the importance of guest experience, and the strategic use of technology to enhance operations and guest retention.
August 13, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – August 13th, 2025

The latest MC Fireside Chats episode featured a lively discussion with glamping entrepreneurs Brian and Ann Konradi of The Yurtopian, industry experts, and technology partners, centering on the importance of unique guest experiences, targeted marketing, and building customer loyalty. The conversation also touched on trends in outdoor hospitality, the balance between technology and personal touch, and the Konradis’ unique decision to raffle off one of their properties.
July 9, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – July 9th, 2025

In the July 9th, 2025 episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl and sponsored by Horizon Outdoor Hospitality, a diverse panel of guests discussed key trends and challenges in the outdoor hospitality industry. The recurring guests included Zach Stoltenberg from LJA and Casey Cochran from Campspot, joined by special guests Natalie Binder from Camp V and Josh Hansen and Rebecca Lindblom from Big Rock Creek. The discussion opened with introductions, where Casey Cochran highlighted Campspot’s role as an online reservation and property management system, emphasizing their marketplace for campers. Zach Stoltenberg, an architect, explained LJA Engineering’s work in designing and funding glamping and outdoor hospitality projects, noting he was joining from his cabin in Colorado with a view of Pikes Peak. Natalie Binder then introduced Camp V, a boutique glamping hotel in a restored historic mining town in Colorado, offering a mix of accommodations and an arts nonprofit for events. Josh Hansen described Big Rock Creek, a large glampground and event venue in Wisconsin, detailing their diverse glamping and camping options, alongside a barn for weddings and large events. Rebecca Lindblom, Josh’s sister, also from Big Rock Creek, later joined the conversation, elaborating on their successful Christmas Light Festival. A significant portion of the chat focused on the holiday weekend performance and revenue management. Casey Cochran reported that many campgrounds achieved 100% occupancy over the Fourth of July, highlighting Campspot’s efforts to automate revenue management by analyzing market and historical data. Brian Searl added that even with fewer camper nights, effective Average Daily Rate (ADR) management could still lead to increased revenue, potentially reducing guest issues. The conversation then shifted to disaster preparedness and emergency response, prompted by Zach Stoltenberg’s discussion of recent flooding in Texas that impacted summer camps and RV parks. He underscored the critical importance of having and practicing a disaster plan, citing a camp that avoided casualties due to robust planning. Natalie Binder shared her own harrowing experience with an electrical fire at Camp V, emphasizing that while they had plans, the actual employee reaction during an emergency is unpredictable and highlighted the need for more psychological and trauma-informed training. She also mentioned their strategy of bringing in trusted “outside contractors” for emergency coverage. Zach Stoltenberg suggested drawing lessons from amusement parks and cruise ships that conduct regular, unannounced drills. Josh Hansen acknowledged the difficulty of consistent training due to seasonal staff turnover. When asked about technological solutions, Casey Cochran noted Campspot’s dashboards could identify occupied sites, and while text messaging is useful, legal opt-in requirements limit its immediate impact in emergencies. Zach Stoltenberg also mentioned integrated hardware systems like Point Central that can automate alerts and controls within units. Ultimately, the consensus was that operators should at least start with a basic plan and rehearse it with their staff. The discussion transitioned to diversifying revenue and event-based marketing. Josh Hansen shared Big Rock Creek’s pivot to camping and glamping during COVID-19, accelerating their event business. Rebecca Lindblom highlighted their hugely successful Miracle at Big Rock Christmas Light Festival, which draws tens of thousands of visitors and effectively generates winter revenue while promoting summer offerings. She advised other operators to focus on efficient resourcing and creating social media-shareable photo opportunities. Natalie Binder revealed that Camp V’s Planet V Fest music festival also grew organically from guest enthusiasm and serves as a powerful marketing tool. She also shared how a $2 million state grant helped them build a new event pavilion. Natalie emphasized that for remote destinations like Camp V, relationship marketing and outbound efforts to attract specific groups are crucial, leveraging the property’s unique assets like dark skies. Both Josh Hansen and Natalie Binder agreed on the unpredictable but valuable nature of influencer marketing. Zach Stoltenberg observed that both Big Rock Creek and Camp V exemplify a business model where experiences and events are primary, with accommodations serving as a secondary component. This approach, he noted, naturally leads to higher revenues and creates lifelong customers. Rebecca Lindblom enthusiastically agreed, stating that event attendees often become repeat guests for all their offerings. Brian Searl concluded that prioritizing the experience generally works more in an operator’s favor. Zach Stoltenberg further distinguished the marketing channels for events (targeting HR directors, wedding planners) versus individual accommodation bookings. Natalie Binder reiterated that their success largely comes from grassroots, word-of-mouth, and direct relationship-building. In closing, Brian Searl thanked the guests. Natalie Binder encouraged visits to campv.com. Josh Hansen directed listeners to bigrockcreekwi.com and miracleatbigrock.com, adding a final thought that early-week glamping or camping can be just as enjoyable as weekends. Rebecca Lindblom also expressed appreciation for the discussion. Zach Stoltenberg highlighted the importance of relationships as a wise business strategy, where trust and connection naturally lead to strong business. Brian Searl then promoted his upcoming podcast, “The Campground of the Future,” before concluding the episode.
June 11, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – June 11th, 2025

On the June 11th, 2025, episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl of Insider Perks and Modern Campground led a vibrant discussion with a panel of industry experts on the evolving landscape of outdoor hospitality. The conversation delved into crucial topics ranging from the practicalities of developing off-grid glamping sites to the profound importance of curating a transformative guest experience. The episode brought together recurring panelists and special guests, each offering unique perspectives from their respective corners of the industry, creating a comprehensive overview of current trends, challenges, and opportunities. The show welcomed back its knowledgeable recurring guests, who consistently provide valuable insights. Scott Foos, representing Horizon Outdoor Hospitality, a third-party management and consulting firm, offered his analysis on market trends and operational strategies. Zach Stoltenberg of LJA, a multidisciplinary design firm, shared his expertise on the planning and design of outdoor resorts. Joe Duemig, the owner of App My Community, brought his perspective on technology and guest communication within campgrounds and resorts. Joining the panel were two special guests, both operators of distinctive Canadian glamping properties. Elizabeth McIntosh, the co-founder of Back Forty Glamping in Ontario, provided a look into the world of creating a luxury, four-season dome resort from the ground up. Also featured was Sarah Cruse, the General Manager of the remote and exclusive Clayoquot Wilderness Lodge on Vancouver Island, who shared her passion for creating deeply restorative and nature-based experiences for guests. The conversation kicked off with Zach Stoltenberg identifying a significant industry trend: the increasing client demand for off-grid and remote resort sites. He explained this push is driven by both the economic desire to avoid costly infrastructure development and the experiential appeal of secluded locations. Zach highlighted innovative solutions like those from Electric Outdoors, a company producing self-contained units with their own power and water systems, which could revolutionize how operators utilize undeveloped land and create unique, low-impact accommodations. Responding to the off-grid theme, Sarah Cruse detailed the operations of Clayoquot Wilderness Lodge, a property that has successfully operated off-grid for 25 years. She explained how the resort, accessible only by floatplane or boat, is a self-contained village that recently invested in British Columbia’s largest solar panel installation to harness the power of nature. Sarah’s story underscored the immense appeal and viability of such ventures but also served as a caution, noting that the “wild west” era of development has passed and that securing permits for such a project today would be incredibly challenging. Elizabeth McIntosh of Back Forty Glamping echoed the sentiment regarding regulatory hurdles, sharing her own complex journey with permitting in Ontario. She explained how the process of trying to fit their unique dome structures into existing, conventional building codes ultimately shaped their business model, forcing them to pivot to a higher-end, luxury offering to justify the extensive investment in infrastructure like a massive septic system. Her experience illustrated a common struggle for innovators in the glamping space and highlighted how external constraints can define a brand’s niche. A significant portion of the discussion was dedicated to the art and importance of the guest experience, a topic Sarah Cruse spoke about with palpable passion. She described her role as stewarding a “heart property” where the goal is to facilitate a “transformational state” in guests by disconnecting them from devices and reconnecting them with nature and each other. She emphasized that true hospitality is “heart-forward,” starting with a happy, engaged staff who genuinely care, which in turn creates an authentic and emotionally resonant experience for the guest. Scott Foos provided a broader market context to the importance of guest experience, sharing observations from a recent tour of over 50 properties across four states. He noted a softening in transient demand and a subsequent pivot by many operators toward chasing extended-stay business. His key finding was that properties demonstrating “intentionality”—those with thoughtful theming, clean aesthetics, visible staff, and a focus on creating a special atmosphere—were significantly outperforming their more generic neighbors, even those located right next door. Offering an international perspective, Joe Duemig recounted his recent trip to Australia for caravan industry shows. He observed a different business landscape, with a prevalence of marketing groups that parks belong to, as opposed to the more common franchise models in North America. He noted differences in pricing and amenity focus, providing a valuable comparison of how the industry operates in another part of the world and highlighting the global nature of outdoor travel. In his final thoughts, Scott Foos shared critical data on the American traveler, noting that while the desire for travel remains high, budget constraints are significant, with the average family having around $5,500 for the entire year. He argued that this economic reality uniquely positions the outdoor hospitality industry to provide value. However, he stressed that now is the time to double down on providing exceptional experiences to retain the core camping audience and continually remind them of the unique value and joy that camping provides. Ultimately, the episode underscored that success in the modern outdoor hospitality industry is a holistic endeavor. It requires navigating practical challenges like permitting and infrastructure, embracing innovation in accommodations, and, most importantly, cultivating an authentic and emotionally intelligent guest experience. The insights from Brian Searl, Scott Foos, Zach Stoltenberg, Joe Duemig, Elizabeth McIntosh, and Sarah Cruse painted a clear picture of an industry where those who focus on the details and lead with heart are best positioned to thrive.
May 14, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – May 14th, 2025

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl of Insider Perks kicked off the conversation by lightheartedly addressing his scratchy voice and acknowledging the absence of several regular panelists, including Joe Duemig, who was attending a conference in Australia, Scott Foos, who had a meeting, and Kevin Thueson, who was traveling. Despite these absences, Searl enthusiastically introduced the two featured guests: John Handy, co-owner of Treebones Resort, and Devon Towle, Founder and CEO of Global Glamping, also known as Sir Glamps-a-lot. John Handy shared the 20-year journey of establishing Treebones Resort in Big Sur with his wife Corinne. He recounted the serendipitous rezoning of their oceanfront property to commercial use and their subsequent decade-long exploration of creating a unique lodging experience. Handy explained that the concept of “glamping” didn’t even exist when they began, but their vision was to offer an experience that combined the closeness to nature of camping with the comforts of a hotel, leading them to discover yurts. He highlighted the significant financial risks they undertook with business and construction loans, contrasting their approach with the revenue-sharing models discussed later. Handy emphasized that the success of Treebones lies in its unique location, the dedicated on-site staff, and the array of amenities, including fine dining with a sushi bar and lodge restaurant, massage, yoga, a pool, spa, and jacuzzi, all while maintaining a low carbon footprint. Devon Towle, or Sir Glamps-a-lot, detailed his entrepreneurial journey, starting from a background in architecture and housing consultation to founding Global Glamping. He shared how his initial foray into glamping began with a single yurt on raw land in Montana, which surprisingly led to recognition as one of the best Hipcamps in the state. This experience highlighted the potential of the industry and the need for guidance, prompting him to establish Global Glamping. Towle proudly mentioned the company’s growth to 15 resorts with over a hundred short-term rentals and their specialization in eco-tourism development. He was particularly excited to be calling in from their Guardian Ranch location in San Diego, showcasing 3D-printed tiny houses from Azure Printed Homes, emphasizing the rapid construction and eco-friendly nature of these units made from recycled materials. The conversation then shifted to the topic of bootstrapping versus seeking investment capital. Towle shared his experience of creatively financing his ventures, including a “Glamping Rev Share” model that allowed him to partner with landowners and structure providers. He emphasized that the barrier to entry in glamping can be significantly lower than traditional real estate investments, allowing entrepreneurs to start with modest means and grow creatively. Searl resonated with this, sharing his own experiences of building his business without significant initial investment and highlighting the flexibility and potential rewards of a bootstrapped approach. Both Handy and Towle agreed on the importance of agility and the ability to pivot in business. Handy used a compelling ship analogy, stating that a ship in a harbor is safe but not fulfilling its purpose, and that forward motion is necessary for steering. He shared examples of unforeseen challenges like road closures and economic shifts that require constant adaptation. Towle echoed this, emphasizing that nothing ever goes exactly to plan and that perseverance and the willingness to pivot are crucial for entrepreneurs in the often unpredictable world of eco-tourism and glamping. The discussion touched upon the role of technology in their businesses. Handy highlighted how Starlink internet and advancements in battery storage systems have been game-changers for Treebones, especially given their off-grid location. He also spoke about their adoption of Azure 3D-printed homes as an eco-conscious lodging option. Towle also emphasized the speed to market and cost-effectiveness of the 3D-printed homes. Both expressed excitement about future technological advancements, including the potential of AI in design and 3D printing. Searl raised the topic of disconnecting in a hyper-connected world, sharing his own recent experience of the benefits of unplugging. Handy recounted a story about the Wall Street Journal inquiring about their “prepare to unplug” message from their early days, noting the initial resistance from some guests but also the eventual appreciation for the opportunity to disconnect. He mentioned that while technology has advanced at Treebones, they still maintain areas where guests can intentionally unplug. Looking towards the future, Handy expressed that Treebones Resort would remain family-owned and operated, with the next generation taking on leadership roles. He emphasized their commitment to maintaining the essence of Treebones – perching lightly on the land, living simply, and connecting with nature – even as they evolve. Towle shared his vision for Global Glamping, aiming to create affordable, eco-friendly living communities and develop a gamified app to enhance the ecotourism experience. He expressed a long-term goal of securing larger-scale funding to expand these communities for midterm and long-term living, promoting a lifestyle connected to nature and entrepreneurship. In closing, Searl expressed his admiration for the work of both Handy and Towle, predicting a bright future for their ventures and the eco-tourism industry as a whole. He underscored the power of inspiring others through their innovative approaches to hospitality and sustainable living.
April 9, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – April 9th, 2025

This MC Fireside Chats episode on April 9th, 2025, hosted by Brian Searl from Insider Perks, brought together a panel of experts to discuss the current state and future trends of the outdoor hospitality industry. The recurring guests, Joe Duemig, the owner and founder of App My Community, a company specializing in mobile apps for campground guest engagement and communication, and Kevin Thueson, a partner at KCN Campgrounds, a real estate investment firm operating a portfolio of nine KOA franchise parks, were joined by special guests Lucy Comer, the co-owner and founder of Hadspen Glamping, an off-grid glamping site in Southwest England, and Jen Rice, the general manager at Empire Recreation Management and WhoaZone, which develops water-based family entertainment centers. The central theme of the discussion revolved around the anticipated impact of the prevailing economic uncertainty and the rapidly evolving sociopolitical landscape on camper behavior in the 2025 season. Brian Searl initiated the conversation by referencing early data that suggested an uptick in reservations for early 2025 compared to the previous year. However, this optimistic outlook was immediately challenged by Kevin Thueson, who reported seeing a contrary trend within KCN Campgrounds, with reservations currently lagging behind the same period last year. He attributed this hesitancy among travelers to the continued uncertainty stemming from various factors, including the recent election and ongoing rapid changes. Joe Duemig offered a more nuanced perspective, suggesting that the impact of these uncertainties would likely vary significantly depending on the specific characteristics of individual campgrounds. He posited that factors such as the type of park (e.g., destination-focused versus en-route stops) and its geographical location would play a crucial role in determining its resilience. He voiced particular concern for campgrounds that heavily cater to snowbirds and those with a significant portion of their clientele coming from Canada, given the existing political tensions and reported decrease in border crossings. While acknowledging the historical trend of campgrounds performing well during economic downturns as a more affordable travel option, Joe Duemig cautioned that the recent increase in campground rates might alter this dynamic. He advised campground owners to proactively develop backup plans to mitigate potential negative impacts. Kevin Thueson further elaborated on the booking trends, suggesting that the current situation might not necessarily indicate a crisis but rather a reversion to pre-pandemic travel patterns. He recalled that before the surge in early and extended bookings during COVID-19, the majority of reservations were typically made much closer to the stay date. He also pointed out the significant decline in international travel since the onset of the pandemic and the slow pace of its recovery, which could influence the impact of current international travel advisories. He emphasized the importance of differentiating between overnight or journey-style parks, which traditionally experience slower reservation pick-up, and destination parks that often see bookings well in advance. Shifting the focus to the UK market, Lucy Comer provided an insightful perspective from Hadspen Glamping. She reported a substantial cost of living crisis in the UK, which has influenced travel patterns. Interestingly, despite this economic pressure, their bookings for April were double compared to the same month in the previous year. However, she also noted a clear trend of people opting for more local vacations and a significant decrease in international travel to their site. Lucy Comer highlighted that Hadspen Glamping’s success lies in offering a unique experience centered around sustainability, its off-grid nature, and its deep connection with the local environment and suppliers. She emphasized that they are selling an escape and an experience rather than simply accommodation. The conversation then transitioned to strategies for enhancing the guest experience. Kevin Thueson underscored the critical role of exceptional hospitality and actively engaging with guests as a key differentiator, particularly for campgrounds that might not have the newest facilities. He suggested practical ways to elevate the guest experience, such as organizing tournaments and events around existing amenities like mini-golf or newly added pickleball courts. Joe Duemig, drawing from his extensive travel experiences with his large family, echoed the sentiment about the importance of friendly and attentive customer service. He shared positive anecdotes from campgrounds that went the extra mile, such as offering free water sports equipment, proactively providing assistance, and offering small but impactful gestures like welcome drinks for adults and children. Jen Rice introduced WhoaZone, explaining its mission to revitalize existing bodies of water in various settings by installing inflatable water-based attractions for family entertainment. She emphasized the goal of encouraging outdoor recreation and providing an immersive and thrilling experience for guests, whether they are staying at a partnering campground or visiting for the day. Jen Rice highlighted that WhoaZone’s unique selling proposition is their deep operational experience, as they not only provide the equipment but also manage and operate the attractions, bringing a practical, on-the-ground perspective to their clients. Finally, the discussion touched upon the future of the industry, particularly concerning sustainability and the adoption of new technologies like electric vehicle (EV) charging stations. Lucy Comer discussed the challenges of implementing EV charging at an off-grid glamping site and the importance of ensuring that any technological additions are both effective and user-friendly for guests. Kevin Thueson provided a pragmatic view on investing in EV infrastructure, emphasizing the need to balance the potential demand with the financial implications for investors and the rapidly evolving nature of the technology. He suggested a cautious approach, monitoring the actual demand and the technological advancements before making significant capital investments, as overspending based on speculation could be risky. In conclusion, Brian Searl thanked the insightful panel for their contributions, providing listeners with contact information for Hadspen Glamping (hadspenglamping.co.uk), App My Community (appmycommunity.com), and WhoaZone (gowhoazone.com). He announced the upcoming Outwired podcast episode, promising further data-driven discussions on consumer behavior in the outdoor hospitality sector.

Recurring Guests

Tom Mason, IVEE Group

Tom Mason

IVEE Group
Zach Stoltenberg, Clockwork

Zach Stoltenberg

Clockwork

Landan Dory

North Star Brokerage & Advisory

Jayne Cohen, Campground Consulting Group

Jayne Cohen

Campground Consulting Group

Scott Foos, Horizon Outdoor Hospitality

Scott Foos

Horizon Outdoor Hospitality
Jeremy Johnson, Kona Hills Campground

Jeremy Johnson

Kona Hills Campground
Kaleigh Day, Surf Junction Campground

Kaleigh Day

Surf Junction Campground

Week 3 - Business Operations and Management

On the third Wednesday, we tackle the operational side of running a successful campground. This episode features operations consultants and experts discussing strategies for staff management, technology integration, and maintaining profitability while navigating challenges.

September 16, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 16th, 2026

During the September 19, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, insurance and outdoor hospitality experts emphasized that combating rising premiums and frivolous lawsuits requires operators to strictly enforce liability waivers, maintain pristine safety records, and secure specialized policies to protect their long-term profitability.
August 19, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – August 19th, 2026

During this episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts emphasized that to survive rising interest rates and a post-COVID refinancing squeeze, campground owners must move away from generic operations and rigorously target a specific ideal customer profile to maintain profitability and secure strong property valuations.
July 15, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 15th, 2026

During the July 15, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts emphasized the critical need for versatility in outdoor hospitality by exploring long-term tax strategies, the debate between market oversupply and camper affordability, and the strategic value of incorporating tent sites and glamping to drive future growth.
June 17, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – June 17th, 2026

In the June 17, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, industry experts discussed the launch of a new outdoor hospitality data dashboard, the operational benefits of solid-wall yurt cabins, and the need for campgrounds to prepare for upcoming electrical code changes affecting RV pedestals.
May 20, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – May 20th, 2026

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl interviews newcomer campground owner Jon Thatcher, exploring how modern operators can revitalize the outdoor hospitality industry by lowering barriers for younger generations, embracing premium glamping experiences, and utilizing innovative technology.
April 15, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 15th, 2026

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl, Robert Preston, Angele Miller, and Cody Fall discuss the rapid professionalization of the campground industry, ranging from the operational hurdles of managing dozens of properties to the successful integration of high-end wellness amenities. The group emphasizes that while scaling and technology are essential for growth, the core of their success lies in understanding shifting traveler demographics and revitalizing aging infrastructure to preserve the outdoor experience for future generations.
March 18, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – March 18th, 2026

In this MC Fireside Chats episode, industry experts discuss how campground operators can navigate economic shifts by focusing on data-driven management and resolving operational bottlenecks like poor customer service. They also debate the delicate balance between adopting new technologies, such as digital check-ins, and maintaining the essential human element of outdoor hospitality.
February 18, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – February 18th, 2026

Host Brian Searl and industry experts Mike Harrison, Robert Preston, Sandy Ellingson, and Jeff Hoffman discussed the current economic cycle of the outdoor hospitality industry, focusing on market corrections and the importance of professional property management. The episode featured special guest Saurav Ghosal of Sojourn Lodging, who received strategic mentorship on rebranding, navigating seasonal occupancy shifts, and transitioning from an “outdoor hotel” identity to a defined glamping experience.
January 21, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – January 21st, 2026

Host Brian Searl leads a panel of industry experts and special guests from Daiva RV Resorts and Let’s Camp to discuss the 2026 outlook, debating the contrast between optimistic RV show attendance and the reality of normalizing booking windows and occupancy. The conversation further explores strategies for aligning state and national associations for better advocacy, balancing corporate efficiency with family-centric hospitality, and the increasing necessity of leveraging AI and data analytics in outdoor recreation.

Recurring Guests

Jeff Hoffman, Camp Strategy

Jeff Hoffman

Camp Strategy
Sandy Ellingson, RV Industry Advisor

Sandy Ellingson

RV Industry Advisor
Mike Harrison, CRR Hospitality

Mike Harrison

CRR Hospitality
Angele Miller, Creekside RnR Glamping

Angele Miller

Creekside RnR Glamping
Robert Preston, Unhitched Management

Robert Preston

Unhitched Management
Casey Cochran, Campspot

Casey Cochran

Campspot
John McMahon, Camp Door County RV Resort & Campground

John McMahon

Camp Door County RV Resort & Campground

Week 4 - Marketing, AI, and Technology

The fourth Wednesday of the month covers the latest tools and marketing strategies driving innovation in outdoor hospitality. Guests include marketing pros, AI experts, and tech providers exploring personalized marketing, smart technologies, digital engagement, and data-driven operations.

January 22, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – January 22nd, 2025

The January 22, 2025, episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, brought together a panel of experts to discuss the RV industry, glamping, and outdoor hospitality trends. Panelists included Eleonore Hamm, President of RVDA Canada; Shane Devenish, Executive Director of the Canadian Recreational Vehicle Association; Angele Miller, Co-Founder of Creekside RNR Glamping; and Greg Emmert, Consultant at Camp Strategy. The conversation delved into consumer trends, industry challenges, and the need for better storytelling in the RV and glamping sectors. Brian introduced the revamped show format and engaged panelists in a light-hearted discussion about the new intro. The group shared their respective roles and perspectives within their industries. Eleonore and Shane highlighted their focus on advocacy, education, and industry collaboration in Canada, while Angele shared her experiences running a glamping resort, emphasizing the importance of meeting rising consumer expectations. Angele discussed the increasing consumer demand for luxury amenities such as saunas and hot tubs at glamping resorts. She noted that guests are seeking highly personalized experiences, making it crucial for operators to continuously innovate. Brian and Greg agreed, noting that the RV park and campground industry is experiencing a similar shift toward high-end, customized experiences. Greg emphasized the importance of campground owners identifying their “why” to stand out in a competitive market. He encouraged operators to focus on unique offerings that resonate with guests. Angele shared how her resort builds customer loyalty by personalizing experiences, such as remembering special occasions, which Greg praised as a model for other operators. Eleonore and Shane spoke about their advocacy efforts in Canada, particularly in light of challenges like pending legislation and economic uncertainty. They highlighted the close collaboration among Canadian RV associations, contrasting it with the larger, more segmented U.S. market. The panel discussed economic concerns, including inflation, exchange rates, and potential tariffs, and their impact on consumer confidence. Shane expressed cautious optimism about RV sales in 2025, while Eleonore noted that affordability remains a key message in their marketing efforts. Angele shared insights on how economic pressures are affecting the glamping industry, with some operators scaling back or closing for the winter. The conversation turned to managing consumer expectations and addressing negative feedback. Shane and Greg discussed the challenges of dealing with complaints, emphasizing the need for empathy and perspective. Angele added that proactive communication and attention to detail can help mitigate dissatisfaction and build loyalty. The group explored trends in RV manufacturing, with Shane noting that consumer demand drives product offerings. Eleonore pointed out that while fifth wheels showed growth in 2024, manufacturers respond to a variety of consumer preferences, from lightweight towables to larger, more luxurious units. Greg drew parallels between the RV industry’s challenges and Angele’s approach to affordability in glamping. While RV manufacturers face logistical and economic hurdles in building affordable units, Angele shared how her resort strikes a balance between luxury and cost-effectiveness to remain competitive. Brian raised concerns about how the RV industry’s positive stories, beyond shipment numbers, are underrepresented in campground-related media. Eleonore and Shane agreed on the need for broader communication, with Eleonore suggesting better integration of resources to share meaningful industry insights. The panelists expressed cautious optimism for 2025. Shane predicted stable demand for RVs, while Angele anticipated steady interest in outdoor experiences, albeit with shifts in consumer spending. The group agreed that adaptability and a focus on consumer needs would be critical for success. The episode concluded with Brian thanking the panelists and inviting the audience to explore more through their respective organizations. It was a dynamic discussion that shed light on both challenges and opportunities in the RV and glamping sectors.
November 27, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – November 27th, 2024

This week’s episode of MC Fireside Chats focused on the evolving RV and campground industries, with host Brian Searl joined by Eleanor Hamm of RVDA of Canada, Shane Devenish of CRVA, and special guest Daniel Clarkson from Navico Connect. The conversation highlighted current trends, key takeaways from recent conferences, and how technology is shaping the future of outdoor hospitality. The episode opened with reflections on the RVDA convention, where Eleanor and Shane discussed key sessions on artificial intelligence, fixed operations, and dealer education. Eleanor noted the success of the Dealer of the Year award and the value of networking opportunities, which remain central to the event’s impact. Shane added that while attendance from Canadian delegates was slightly down, the overall participation increased, signaling strong industry engagement. Daniel Clarkson introduced Navico Connect’s integrated RV systems, which enhance the user experience by automating functions, improving safety, and streamlining power management. He explained how Navico’s lithium-ion battery technology reduces risks and supports off-grid adventures, while features like power regulation prevent electrical issues at campgrounds. Daniel emphasized the systems’ adaptability for both OEMs and aftermarket installations. Upcoming regulatory changes, such as the 2026 mandate for ground fault disruptors, were discussed in detail. Drawing from Navico’s expertise in marine systems, Daniel explained how the transition would improve safety without causing major disruptions. The team explored how campground owners could benefit from these innovations while preparing their infrastructure to accommodate the new standards. Eleanor shared her experience attending the National Campground Conference, emphasizing the openness and collaboration among campground operators. She highlighted the willingness of industry veterans to share knowledge and support newcomers, a dynamic that stood out compared to other trade shows. Shane echoed this sentiment, noting the importance of creating spaces for campground owners to connect and learn from one another. The panel also discussed opportunities to expand and improve conferences, such as increasing representation from additional provinces and building out trade show components. Suggestions included hosting more association-specific events and integrating educational sessions more strategically to keep attendees engaged with exhibitors. Daniel detailed Navico’s commitment to enhancing the RV experience with features like app-based control of lighting, heating, and energy consumption. He also discussed the potential for Navico’s systems in the RV rental market, highlighting tools that allow fleet owners to monitor and manage vehicles remotely. These innovations align with a growing industry focus on convenience and efficiency. The conversation reinforced the role of technology in improving customer satisfaction, with Daniel addressing practical concerns like range anxiety and campground power compatibility. Navico’s ability to integrate proven marine technologies into RV systems has positioned the company as a leader in advancing RV functionality and safety. As the episode closed, the guests reflected on the unique dynamics of the RV and campground industries, emphasizing the importance of education, innovation, and community in driving growth. The panel expressed gratitude for the opportunities these conferences and discussions provide, especially in fostering collaboration across sectors. This episode marked the conclusion of the podcast’s RV industry-focused series. The team expressed appreciation for their partnerships and looked ahead to the evolving landscape of outdoor hospitality with optimism and enthusiasm.
October 23, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – October 23rd, 2024

In the October 23rd, 2024 episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl was joined by key industry leaders to discuss trends and issues in outdoor recreation, focusing on the RV, boating, and hiking industries. The episode featured recurring guests Phil Ingrassia from RVDA of the United States, Eleonore Hamm from RVDA of Canada, Shane Devenish from the Canadian RV Association, and special guests Maggie Peikon from the American Hiking Society and Rick Layzell from the Boating Ontario Association. The conversation navigated the interconnections between these outdoor sectors, addressing challenges, opportunities, and shared interests. Brian opened the episode by acknowledging the rapid advancements in AI and the pressure to maintain innovation in outdoor hospitality news. This set the tone for a lighthearted but deep conversation about technological changes and their effect on industries, particularly the outdoor space. However, the focus soon shifted back to the core subjects of the RV and boating markets, starting with the recent interest rate drop in Canada, which Phil and Eleonore noted could be a positive boost for both RV and boating sales. Rick echoed this sentiment, explaining that high interest rates had discouraged first-time buyers in the boating sector, especially families looking for affordable payment options. Rick elaborated on the impact of economic conditions on the boating industry, mentioning how first-time buyers have disappeared due to rising costs, particularly for larger boats that are now subject to a luxury tax in Canada. This has created a gap in the market, which has been difficult to fill. Meanwhile, RV sales have also experienced similar pressures, with rising interest rates affecting family affordability. The participants reflected on how these economic factors are pushing consumers to reconsider their recreational purchases. The group discussed how both boating and RVing are part of a broader outdoor lifestyle. As Rick pointed out, many boating enthusiasts also use RVs and vice versa, creating crossover opportunities for marketing. Brian asked Phil if there was any data on consumers choosing to purchase RVs over boats, especially as a way to combine their love for the outdoors in a more flexible way. Phil noted that although there are no concrete statistics on this, there is evidence of increased interest in multi-use outdoor recreational vehicles and services. The conversation then turned to hiking, with Maggie Peikon introducing the American Hiking Society’s role in promoting and preserving hiking trails across the U.S. Maggie described programs like volunteer vacations, where participants help maintain and build trails. She emphasized the importance of these efforts, noting that many people enjoy hiking but may not consider the behind-the-scenes work that goes into maintaining the trails they love. Maggie highlighted that the hiking community is diverse and includes RVers, tent campers, and even luxury travelers who seek the benefits of nature. Shane and Rick were curious about how campgrounds could better cater to hiking groups. Maggie suggested that campgrounds offering group camping for hiking clubs could be a draw. Additionally, she noted that amenities like clean showers and laundry facilities are often a big selling point for hikers who want a little comfort after a long day on the trails. Brian tied the discussion back to marketing, reflecting on how campgrounds and RV dealers could better target hikers. He realized that creating specific pages on websites tailored to hikers and other niche outdoor enthusiasts could help better align marketing with what potential guests and buyers are seeking. Eleonore and Phil agreed, pointing out that cross-promotion between the RV, boating, and hiking industries could open up new avenues for business and create a more cohesive outdoor experience for customers. In closing, the panel agreed that outdoor industries like hiking, RVing, and boating need to continue collaborating and adapting to shifting consumer demands. As families weigh their options, it’s crucial for businesses in these sectors to emphasize simplicity, affordability, and the unique experiences that outdoor recreation offers. This episode was a comprehensive dive into how the outdoor industries are navigating current economic realities, changes in consumer behavior, and the potential for cross-industry partnerships. The conversation underscored the importance of staying innovative and understanding the evolving needs of outdoor enthusiasts in a time of rapid change.
September 25, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – September 25th, 2024

In the latest episode of MC Fireside Chats on September 25, 2024, hosted by Brian Searl, a vibrant conversation unfolded with prominent guests from the RV Industry. The discussion brought together Becky Goodell, CEO of Blacksford RV Rentals; Nika Shneyder, co-founder of Chill RV ; along with regular contributors like Eleonore Hamm, President of the RV Dealers Association (RVDA) of Canada; Phil Ingrassia, President of the RVDA; and Susan Carpenter from the RV Women’s Alliance. The episode kicked off with introductions from the panel, where Eleonore Hamm shared insights into the RVDA of Canada’s strategic goals focusing on advocacy, education, and industry intelligence. She emphasized how these industry conversations help to provide valuable updates about the current state of the RV sector. Becky Goodell, CEO of Blacksford RV Rentals, followed, sharing her journey to Elkhart, Indiana, where she was exploring new RV models from major manufacturers like Thor and Winnebago. Becky emphasized how her company, a premium RV rental business, focuses on delivering luxury experiences in locations like Yellowstone, Glacier, and Teton National Parks, with expansions underway in Las Vegas and Phoenix. Nika Shneyder of Chill RV provided a look into her family-run business, which offers luxury RV rentals in Los Angeles. She detailed how the business started in 2016 and has since managed over 2,000 reservations. Both Becky and Nika underscored the demand for high-quality, full-service RV rentals. Despite the broader market fluctuations, ChillRV’s fleet of 16 luxury RVs has faced some softening demand compared to the post-pandemic boom, though the luxury sector, particularly in the RV world, remains largely stable. Phil Ingrassia and Susan Carpenter joined the conversation from the ongoing RV Open House in Elkhart, where manufacturers showcase their latest products to dealers. Phil highlighted that this year’s theme revolved around innovation and affordability, with electric and hybrid RV models taking center stage. Thor Industries, for example, showcased a hybrid electric motorhome that sparked considerable interest among attendees. Susan, reporting from the same event, echoed Phil’s optimism and pointed out that despite challenging weather, spirits remained high at the RVDA Open House Breakfast, which saw standing-room-only attendance. A significant part of the conversation centered around the evolving landscape of RV rentals. Becky and Nika emphasized how their companies prioritize customer service, offering full packages that include unlimited mileage, roadside assistance, and the promise of seamless experiences. Becky, representing Blacksford, illustrated how they ensure their clients have everything they need for their trips, from linens to kitchen supplies, while also spending ample time training customers on RV use, especially for first-time renters. Nika echoed similar sentiments, emphasizing that providing premium service is what differentiates her business from peer-to-peer platforms like Outdoorsy or RVShare. The discussion turned to the challenges of navigating peer-to-peer rental platforms, with Becky and Nika both acknowledging their initial reliance on such platforms to grow their businesses. However, both have since developed their independent booking systems. They highlighted the risks associated with peer-to-peer rentals, such as last-minute cancellations or inconsistent vehicle quality, stressing the importance of customer trust and guaranteed support from established businesses. On the industry front, Eleonore Hamm spoke about how the Canadian RV market is faring, and the group discussed the implications of interest rates and economic factors on RV sales. While some regions and sectors see a softening in demand, the luxury market, especially in RV rentals and resorts, seems to be weathering economic challenges better than expected. Phil Ingrassia added that consumers remain interested in innovative and affordable options, and manufacturers are responding with new models that cater to both high-end buyers and more budget-conscious customers. The panel also explored the rising trend of RV rentals for festivals like Burning Man. Nika shared how ChillRV has found a profitable niche serving Burning Man attendees, despite the potential wear and tear on vehicles. While Becky mentioned Blacksford’s hesitance to cater to Burning Man due to insurance issues, Nika explained that careful preparation and premium pricing have made this market highly lucrative for her company. As the episode wrapped up, the focus shifted to future growth and expansion. Becky discussed how Blacksford is looking to scale its operations while maintaining its premium service standards. The challenge, she noted, lies in finding the right manufacturers and financing options to support their growing fleet. Nika expressed similar aspirations for ChillRV, sharing her plans to expand services at future festivals, including offering a more comprehensive experience with extra amenities and support for clients. In closing, Susan Carpenter shared updates from the RV Women’s Alliance, announcing their latest charity collaboration and highlighting the upcoming awards program that celebrates trailblazers and rising stars in the RV industry. The discussion ended on a hopeful note, with the panelists looking forward to future industry events, including the upcoming RV Dealers Convention in Las Vegas, where further industry insights and opportunities will be explored. Overall, the episode captured the optimism and innovation driving the RV industry forward, despite current market challenges, with an emphasis on quality service, customer trust, and adapting to evolving market demands.
August 28, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – August 28th, 2024

The August 28th, 2024 episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, featured an engaging discussion with four industry experts: Eleonore Hamm, Mark Fawcett, Andrea Pierantozzi, and Aaron Pfadt. The episode focused on various aspects of the RV, boating, and outdoor hospitality industries, providing valuable insights and perspectives. Eleonore Hamm introduced herself as the President of the RV Dealers Association of Canada (RVDA), highlighting the association’s role in representing nearly 400 RV dealers across Canada. She emphasized the importance of education, government relations, and industry intelligence in supporting the RV industry. Mark Fawcett, representing Earth Cruiser Australia, detailed his company’s manufacturing of high-end, off-road motorhomes designed for remote, off-grid adventures. He discussed the challenges and innovations in producing vehicles that are lightweight, durable, and capable of navigating extreme environments. Mark also shared stories of Earth Cruiser’s commitment to customer service, including providing support in remote locations. Andrea Pierantozzi from the Recreational Boating Association of Washington (RBAW) talked about her role in advocating for the rights and interests of recreational boaters. She explained the association’s efforts in ensuring that tax dollars are properly allocated to maintain and improve boating facilities and access, drawing parallels between the needs of boaters and RVers. Aaron Pfadt, founder of Off Highway Van, discussed his company’s focus on manufacturing high-quality, customizable Class B RVs. He highlighted the importance of direct-to-consumer sales and the challenges of maintaining high standards in a competitive market. Aaron also touched on the crossover between the RV and boating industries, particularly in the adoption of advanced technologies and customer service practices. Throughout the episode, the speakers explored the synergies between the RV and boating industries, particularly in the areas of customer service, technological innovation, and the need for adequate facilities and infrastructure. They also discussed the challenges posed by economic conditions and the strategies their respective organizations are employing to navigate these challenges. The episode concluded with each guest sharing where viewers can learn more about their respective organizations, and Brian announcing that he will be away for the next two weeks, with guest hosts stepping in during his absence.
July 24, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – July 24th, 2024

In the latest episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, the focus was on the RV industry, featuring an engaging panel of guests including Shane Devenish from the Canadian Recreational Vehicle Association (CRVA), Susan Carpenter from the RV Women’s Alliance (RVWA), and Angie Diedrich from the Wisconsin RV Dealers Alliance. Brian opened the show with his signature enthusiasm, highlighting the relevance of this fourth week focused on the RV industry. The conversation began with an introduction of the guests, where Susan Carpenter discussed the RV Women’s Alliance. Susan explained how RVWA supports women in the male-dominated RV industry by offering empowerment, education, and networking opportunities. She mentioned the upcoming Women’s Equality Day event, a collaborative effort between multiple RV organizations, aimed at celebrating and supporting women in the industry. Shane Devenish introduced himself, sharing insights about CRVA’s role in supporting manufacturers and suppliers within Canada’s RV industry. He expressed pride in the association’s support for RVWA during their annual camping and RV show. Shane highlighted the collaborative spirit within the Canadian RV industry, emphasizing how various stakeholders work together for mutual benefit, a stark contrast to his experiences in the U.S. Angie Diedrich then took the spotlight, explaining the unique structure of the Wisconsin RV Dealers Alliance, which was formed to address the lack of regulation and dealer protection within the state. She detailed their primary role in lobbying for legislation that protects dealer rights and supports succession planning for family-owned businesses. Angie proudly announced the recent passage of a dealer protection law in Wisconsin, effective October 1, which mandates a 90-day notice and valid reason before a manufacturer can terminate a dealership agreement. The discussion then shifted to broader industry trends and challenges. Angie shared insights about the changing dynamics within the industry post-COVID, including the entrance of larger dealerships and auto dealers into the RV market. This shift has brought about new challenges and opportunities for smaller, family-owned businesses. Brian and Shane delved into the economic aspects affecting the RV industry. Shane noted the impact of rising interest rates and inflation on manufacturers and consumers. He highlighted the challenges faced during the pandemic, particularly supply chain issues, but also expressed optimism about the future, citing recent interest rate cuts in Canada as a positive development for the industry. The conversation took an interesting turn when Brian speculated about the possible reasons for the variations in RV prices across different states. The panel discussed factors like freight costs, sales tax differences, and regional economic conditions. Shane mentioned the importance of local suppliers for Canadian manufacturers, while Angie discussed Wisconsin’s relatively low sales tax and its impact on RV sales. Towards the end of the show, the panel addressed the challenges faced by new associations like Angie’s in building membership and engaging members. Angie emphasized the importance of demonstrating the value of membership to dealers, especially in terms of legislative protection and support. Brian wrapped up the episode on a positive note, asking each guest to share something they were excited about in the industry. Shane mentioned the upcoming induction of Terry Eligh from Triple E Motorhomes into the RV/MH Hall of Fame, a significant honor for the Canadian RV industry. Susan highlighted the RV Women’s Alliance’s upcoming Women’s Equality Day celebration, a collaborative event bringing together multiple RV organizations to support and celebrate women in the industry. Angie discussed the next legislative goal for her organization, which is to work on sales tax exemption for out-of-state customers, a challenging but important task for Wisconsin dealers. Overall, the episode provided a comprehensive look at the current state of the RV industry, highlighting the challenges, successes, and future directions as seen by industry leaders.
Banner for "MC Fireside Chats" podcast on May 22nd, 2024. This week's guests: Jeff Wertz, Greg Wallman, Devon Wilson. Sponsored by AccessParks. Logos for Modern Campground and Insider Perks are at the bottom.
May 22, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – May 22nd, 2024

In a recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, an insightful discussion unfolded featuring Greg Wallman, Owner and President of Space Craft; Devon Wilson, CEO and Founder of RV SnapPad; and Jeff Wertz, Product Business Manager at Spartan RV. The conversation provided a deep dive into the evolving RV and campground industries, touching on various technological advancements, market trends, and the challenges these sectors face in keeping up with rapid growth and innovation. Greg Wallman began by highlighting the importance of technological integration in RVs and campgrounds. He emphasized the growing demand for reliable Wi-Fi and electrical infrastructure to support remote work and leisure activities. Wallman noted that many of their customers now live and work full-time in their RVs, which necessitates advanced networking capabilities. This trend is pushing manufacturers to innovate and adapt quickly to meet the evolving needs of RV users. Jeff Wertz from Spartan RV echoed these sentiments, emphasizing the critical role of information technology in the RV industry. He pointed out that even families are increasingly using RVs for extended travel while maintaining their work commitments. Wertz also discussed the growing interest in electric vehicles (EVs) and the integration of lithium batteries to extend boondocking capabilities. This shift towards more sustainable and efficient power solutions is a significant focus for manufacturers and chassis providers like Spartan RV. Devon Wilson of RV SnapPad added that the market is indeed getting younger, with more people embracing the flexibility of remote work. This demographic shift is driving demand for RVs equipped with modern conveniences and smart technologies. Wilson also shared his company’s experience with artificial intelligence (AI), particularly in customer service. He described how RV SnapPad is leveraging AI to handle standard queries and improve customer interactions, though they remain cautious about over-reliance on technology, ensuring the human element remains a core part of their service. The conversation delved into specific innovations in RV design, with Wallman sharing some cutting-edge developments. He mentioned water makers that extract water from the air, advanced blackwater processing systems, and recycling showers designed for long-term sustainability. These innovations are particularly beneficial for boondocking, allowing RV users to stay off-grid for extended periods without sacrificing comfort or convenience. Jeff Wertz elaborated on the role of Spartan RV in supporting these technological advancements. He explained how the company is involved in integrating larger alternators and advanced power systems to support the increased electrical demands of modern RVs. Wertz also touched on the potential future integration of electric vehicle technology into RVs, noting the challenges and opportunities this presents, especially in balancing the need for large water tanks and other amenities with the space and weight constraints of EVs. Brian Searl, the host, steered the conversation towards future-proofing campgrounds. He inquired about the steps campground owners could take to stay ahead of the curve. Wallman and Wertz both agreed that investing in robust electrical infrastructure and reliable information technology is crucial. They emphasized that campers increasingly expect high-quality internet access and ample power for their devices, making these elements essential for attracting and retaining customers. The discussion also touched on the potential impact of AI and robotics on the RV and campground industries. Searl posed a thought-provoking question about the hypothetical scenario of employing robots if they could perform tasks perfectly tailored to the business’s needs. Wallman and Wertz were open to the idea but highlighted the importance of validating the capabilities of such technology. Wilson, on the other hand, expressed a degree of skepticism, citing trust issues and the need to balance technological advancements with maintaining a personal touch in customer service. Greg Wallman shared some fascinating insights into the custom RV manufacturing process. He described how Space Craft receives unique customer requests that often push the boundaries of current technology. Wallman noted that while some ideas are not yet feasible, the company enjoys the challenge of finding innovative solutions and has had several “aha” moments where they were able to implement groundbreaking features that customers had not initially considered. Devon Wilson concluded by reflecting on the rapid pace of technological growth and its implications for the RV industry. He mentioned that RV SnapPad is continually exploring new technologies to enhance their products and services. However, Wilson stressed the importance of not overcommitting to unproven technologies and ensuring that any new implementations genuinely add value to the customer experience. Overall, the episode provided a comprehensive overview of the current state and future direction of the RV and campground industries. The insights from Greg Wallman, Devon Wilson, and Jeff Wertz highlighted the importance of staying adaptable, embracing technological advancements, and always considering the evolving needs of the customer. As the industry continues to innovate, it is clear that those who can effectively integrate new technologies while maintaining a high level of customer service will be best positioned for success.
Graphic for "MC Fireside Chats" podcast featuring a campfire logo, listing guests David Ramsay, Brian Fuentes, Eleanor Hamm, and Susan Carpenter, sponsored by AccessParks and Modern
April 24, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – April 24th, 2024

In the recent episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl led a comprehensive discussion with prominent figures in the RV and outdoor hospitality industry. The conversation covered a wide range of topics that are currently shaping the future of RVing. Key industry leaders including David Ramsay and Brian Fuente, who represent innovative RV companies, shared their insights on market expansion and the pivotal role of technology in evolving RV designs. Their companies focus on making RVs more accessible and appealing to a broader audience, which includes a significant increase in first-time RV owners who are attracted by user-friendly and technologically advanced features. Phil Ingrassia and Shane Devenish offered perspectives on broader industry trends, such as the need for simpler, more intuitive RV technologies that can accommodate an increasingly diverse consumer base. They discussed how the industry is adapting to meet these demands through both product development and enhanced customer service strategies. Eleonore Hamm contributed to the discussion by highlighting the importance of advocacy and educational initiatives in Canada, which aim to foster a deeper understanding and appreciation of RVing, particularly emphasizing how technologies like Starlink can transform RVing experiences in remote areas. Susan Carpenter spoke about the notable rise in solo female travelers in the RV sector, pointing out that vehicle designs are becoming more inclusive, reducing barriers to entry and making RVing less intimidating for newcomers. The conversation also featured a significant focus on the transformative impact of Starlink’s satellite internet service, with both Ramsay and Fuente explaining how it has revolutionized the connectivity options available to RVers. This innovation has not only enhanced the appeal of off-grid RVing but has also expanded the possibilities for where RVs can travel without losing touch with digital necessities. The dialogue delved into how these advancements are influencing consumer behaviors and expectations, with RV manufacturers increasingly integrating features that promote a blend of comfort, convenience, and connectivity. This shift is not just about accommodating the needs of traditional RV users but also about attracting new demographics who view RVs as viable options for remote work and extended travel. Overall, this episode of MC Fireside Chats provided a rich tapestry of insights that illustrate the dynamic changes occurring in the RV industry. It underscored the industry’s responsiveness to consumer demands and technological advancements, highlighting a promising future for outdoor hospitality. The collective expertise of the speakers painted a picture of an industry at an exciting crossroads, with technology and customer-centric designs driving growth and expanding the horizons of traditional RVing.
Promotional graphic for a 2024 MC Fireside Chats podcast episode featuring guests John Harris, Rich Schnippel, Phil Ingrassia, and Debbie Brunoforte, with a campfire
March 27, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – March 27th, 2024

In an engaging episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, leaders from across the RV industry gathered to discuss the latest trends, innovations, and challenges facing the industry. The panel included Phil Ingrassia from the RV Dealers Association (RVDA), Shane Devenish from the Canadian RV Association (CRVA), John Harris from Harbinger Motors, Rich Schnippel and Mike Depositar from Encore RV, and Debbie Brunoforte from Little Dealer Little Prices RV. Each brought their unique perspective to a conversation that spanned topics from electric RVs to dealership experiences and the future of RV manufacturing. Phil Ingrassia, representing RVDA, shared insights into the dealership side of the RV industry, emphasizing the importance of adapting to consumer demands and the evolving landscape of RV sales. He highlighted the role of dealers in providing quality service and support to RV enthusiasts, ensuring that the buying experience is as enjoyable as the journeys that follow. Ingrassia also touched on the challenges and opportunities presented by the shift towards electric and more sustainable RV options, suggesting that dealers are key to navigating these changes successfully. Shane Devenish from CRVA discussed the Canadian RV market, noting similarities and differences with the U.S. market, particularly in terms of consumer trends and industry challenges. Devenish highlighted the resilience of the Canadian RV industry, despite economic fluctuations, and shared optimism for growth and innovation. He also underscored the importance of industry-wide collaboration and advocacy in promoting RVing as a sustainable and enjoyable way to explore the great outdoors. John Harris of Harbinger Motors introduced a groundbreaking development in the RV industry: electric chassis for RVs. Harris explained how Harbinger Motors is addressing the growing demand for electric vehicles (EVs) in the RV space, focusing on the benefits of electric RVs, such as improved driving experience and reduced environmental impact. He acknowledged the current technological limitations for smaller RVs but expressed confidence in the future advancements that will make electric RVs more accessible and appealing to a broader audience. Rich Schnippel and Mike Depositar from Encore RV shared their journey in the adventure trailer market, emphasizing the importance of quality, innovation, and customer service. Schnippel discussed the challenges of starting and growing an RV manufacturing business, including overcoming setbacks like facility fires and navigating the complexities of product development. Depositar, highlighting his recent addition to the team, spoke to the operational challenges and the focus on maintaining product quality while meeting consumer expectations for value and durability. Debbie Brunoforte, from Little Dealer Little Prices RV, provided a fascinating look into the world of RV retailing, sharing her approach to creating an unforgettable dealership experience. Brunoforte’s dealerships are designed to entertain and educate customers, featuring unique themes that transform the shopping process into an adventure. She discussed how her business adapts to consumer trends and the importance of creating a welcoming environment that reflects the joy and freedom of RVing. The conversation also touched on the broader implications of electric RVs for the industry, with panelists discussing the potential for electrification to transform RV travel. Harris detailed the specific advantages of electric chassis, including the potential for a quieter, more eco-friendly camping experience without the need for traditional generators. The panelists debated the readiness of campgrounds for electric RVs and the importance of infrastructure development to support this transition. Rich Schnippel and Mike Depositar delved deeper into the philosophy behind Encore RV’s product design, emphasizing the balance between innovation and practicality. They discussed the strategic decision to focus on adventure trailers that can be towed by a wide range of vehicles, expanding the accessibility of RVing to a broader audience. Their commitment to building a strong dealer network and ensuring high-quality customer service was highlighted as a cornerstone of their business model. Debbie Brunoforte’s innovative approach to dealership design was explored further, with discussions on how her “edutainment” model has resonated with customers. By creating an immersive shopping experience, Brunoforte has been able to differentiate her dealerships in a competitive market, fostering a deeper connection with customers and enhancing the overall appeal of RVing. The panelists also addressed the challenges of navigating the current economic landscape, with insights into how consumer confidence and economic indicators influence the RV industry. They discussed strategies for adapting to changing consumer preferences, such as the shift towards more economical and environmentally friendly RV options. The episode of MC Fireside Chats offered a comprehensive overview of the RV industry’s current state and future directions. From the exciting potential of electric RVs to innovative dealership experiences and the challenges of manufacturing and market adaptation, the conversation underscored the industry’s dynamic nature. The insights shared by Phil Ingrassia, Shane Devenish, John Harris, Rich Schnippel, Mike Depositar, and Debbie Brunoforte highlighted the collaborative effort required to continue driving the RV industry forward, making RVing an increasingly accessible, enjoyable, and sustainable way to explore the world.

Recurring Guests

Mychele Bisson, Bison Peak Ventures

Mychele Bisson

Bison Peak Ventures
Cara Csizmadia, Canadian Camping & RV Association

Cara Csizmadia

Canadian Camping & RV Association
Matt Whittemore, Climb Capital

Matt Whittemore

Climb Capital
Ravi Parikh, RoverPass

Ravi Parikh

RoverPass
Sarah Stahl, Market Movers

Sarah Stahl

Market Movers

Week 5 - Multi-Sector Show

On the rare occasions when a month has a fifth Wednesday, we present a special multi-sector episode. This collaborative platform brings together a diverse panel of guests from the glamping, campground, RV, outdoor recreation, and activities industries. The rich discussion fosters a multifaceted understanding, offering varied perspectives and insights from across these sectors.

September 30, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – September 30th, 2026

During the September 30, 2026, episode of MC Fireside Chats, property operators Stephanie Bias and Munro Murdock emphasized that the future of outdoor hospitality relies on blending invisible backend technology with highly curated, generation-specific guest experiences—ranging from luxury all-inclusive glamping to diverse, nature-focused hybrid parks.
July 29, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – July 29th, 2026

Industry experts on the July 29th MC Fireside Chats emphasized that hospitality operators must first document their internal workflows to successfully adopt AI and digital tools, enabling them to streamline operations, personalize guest experiences, and increase profitability without losing the essential human touch.
April 29, 2026

MC Fireside Chats – April 29th, 2026

Host Brian Searl and a panel of outdoor hospitality experts—including Marie Nichols, Duncan Winship, and Ashley Cary—discussed how international travel apps, changing generational preferences, and data-driven marketing are transforming the modern camping industry.
October 29, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – October 29th, 2025

The latest MC Fireside Chats episode focused on how glamping operators are revolutionizing outdoor hospitality by prioritizing unique, high-touch guest experiences and personal connection, demonstrating that success in the industry, regardless of scale or location, relies on moving beyond simple accommodation.
July 30, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – July 30th, 2025

In this special fifth week episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl welcomes three glamping pioneers—from the UK to Costa Rica—for a global look at the evolving outdoor hospitality landscape. The guests dive into everything from guest engagement and winter operations to marketing challenges, AI, and the future of glamping.
April 30, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – April 30th, 2025

The MC Fireside Chats episode on April 30th, 2025, began with host Brian Searl acknowledging technical difficulties at the start of the show. Brian then introduced the guests: Mychele Bisson, Mary Sparrow, and Heidi Royle, each bringing a unique perspective on the outdoor hospitality industry. Mychele Bisson shared her work with Bison Peak Ventures, acquiring campgrounds across the country, revitalizing them, and aiming to preserve the original family’s legacy. She emphasized the importance of maintaining the essence of these establishments while introducing modern improvements. Mary Sparrow discussed her ownership of a boatyard in the east of England and her innovative approach to hospitality with floating glamping pods. Her business evolved from traditional houseboats to unique, luxury floating accommodations, offering guests a distinctive experience on the water. Heidi Royle detailed her journey of establishing the Groove Glamping, a glamping site in Minnesota, located near a state park. She highlighted the natural attractions of the area, such as the clear water creeks and the state park, which enhance the appeal of her glamping site. The discussion then shifted to the concept of “glamping,” with various perspectives on its definition and evolution. The guests explored how glamping has changed over time, influenced by social media and the increasing demand for unique outdoor experiences. The challenges and strategies of promoting and operating glamping sites were also discussed. Heidi Royle shared her experience with influencer collaborations to increase awareness of the Grove Glamping. Mary Sparrow provided insights into the complexities of running a business that combines traditional boating with modern glamping. This included the unique considerations for floating accommodations and the importance of preserving the natural environment. Mychele Bisson spoke about Bison Peak Ventures’ business model of acquiring and upgrading campgrounds, emphasizing the rewarding aspect of providing families with opportunities to connect and create memories in nature. A significant part of the conversation focused on the personal fulfillment derived from operating these businesses. The guests shared stories of the joy and satisfaction that comes from seeing families and children enjoy the outdoors, away from the distractions of modern technology. The episode concluded with the guests sharing their final thoughts and where to find more information about their businesses. The overarching theme was the value of creating unique outdoor experiences and the positive impact these experiences have on individuals and families.
January 29, 2025

MC Fireside Chats – January 29th, 2025

In this episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl welcomed Josef Hjelmaker, CEO of Electric Outdoors, Robert Preston, CEO and Founder of Unhitched Management, and Matt and Karina Torres, owners of Bayshore RV Park, to discuss their experiences and insights into the outdoor hospitality and RV park industries. The conversation covered everything from business growth and sustainability to unique guest experiences and the future of the industry. Robert Preston shared his journey from a military pilot to a real estate investor, now owning 14 RV parks through Climb Capital and Unhitched Management. His focus is on fostering a sense of community within his parks, providing spaces where guests can disconnect from daily life and reconnect with nature and each other. He emphasized the importance of safe, clean, and welcoming environments in creating a successful RV park experience. His management philosophy revolves around treating employees well so they, in turn, provide exceptional hospitality to guests. He also spoke about his approach to acquiring and scaling parks, explaining that his growth is based on finding good deals while ensuring that each new acquisition enhances the efficiency and effectiveness of his existing properties. Josef Hjelmaker introduced Electric Outdoors, a company focused on sustainability and innovation in outdoor hospitality. His company develops portable, self-sustaining destination platforms that generate their own energy, manage water, and handle waste independently. The units, designed to be placed in remote or off-grid locations, offer a new way to camp without requiring traditional infrastructure or permits. He explained how these platforms provide flexibility for landowners and park operators, allowing them to create new camping experiences in places previously inaccessible to RVs and traditional campers. The conversation also touched on the growing role of electric vehicles in outdoor recreation, with Josef discussing how his technology supports off-grid stays while accommodating the needs of EV travelers. He highlighted the importance of digital integration, explaining how his platforms use connectivity to enhance user experience through booking, energy management, and local activity recommendations. Matt and Karina Torres shared their experience of acquiring and revitalizing Bayshore RV Park on the Washington coast. Their journey began when Matt, a former framer and general contractor, and Karina, with a background in property management, combined their skills to turn their park into a thriving business. They emphasized the importance of hands-on management, directly engaging with guests to provide personalized service and a welcoming atmosphere. They spoke about their approach to balancing long-term and transient guests, their focus on creating unique experiences such as easy access to crabbing in Willapa Bay, and their strategy for reinvesting profits back into the park. They also discussed their long-term goal of eventually hiring a dedicated manager so they can expand to additional properties while ensuring their guests continue to receive the same level of care and hospitality. The discussion highlighted the changing landscape of the outdoor hospitality industry and the increasing importance of offering more than just a place to stay. The guests agreed that creating meaningful experiences for visitors, whether through high-touch customer service, sustainable accommodations, or fostering a sense of community, is key to long-term success. Brian Searl noted that the industry has thrived for years with minimal effort due to economic conditions, but moving forward, park owners will need to be more intentional about guest experiences to maintain and grow their businesses. He pointed out that travelers are looking for something unique, and parks that can deliver on that will be the ones that stand out in an increasingly competitive market. The conversation also touched on the challenges and rewards of park ownership. Robert spoke about the balance between growth and operational efficiency, explaining that his goal is not just to acquire more properties but to ensure each park is well-run and financially sustainable. He emphasized the importance of hiring entrepreneurial-minded managers who treat the business as their own and make decisions that benefit both guests and ownership. Matt and Karina reflected on their initial struggles and learning experiences, including the realization that hiring the wrong staff can impact guest satisfaction. They shared how they adjusted their management approach to be more involved, ensuring that guests feel valued from the moment they arrive. As the discussion wrapped up, Brian announced the launch of a new podcast called Outwired, which will focus on data, AI, and technology in outdoor hospitality. The show will feature unfiltered discussions on industry trends, innovations, and challenges, with co-hosts Greg Emmert from Camp Strategy and Scott Bahr from Cairn Consulting Group. The episode ended with a shared enthusiasm for the future of the outdoor hospitality industry, with all guests expressing optimism about the opportunities ahead for park owners who are willing to innovate and prioritize guest experiences. The insights from this episode underscored the industry’s evolution, with sustainability, community-building, and technology playing a growing role in shaping the next generation of outdoor accommodations.
October 30, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – October 30th, 2024

In the October 30, 2024 episode of MC Fireside Chats, host Brian Searl brings together several guests to explore various perspectives in outdoor hospitality and the RV industry. The episode features Ken Barber from Wild Haven Glamping, Leslie Taylor-Rharbi from Signature RV Resorts by Zeman, and Paul Craven and Anthony Wollschlager from Airxcel. Brian starts by introducing the guests, encouraging them to share insights about their companies and experiences. Leslie kicks things off by describing her role in managing Zeman’s luxury RV resorts, specifically the “Signature” line, known for providing high-end amenities and tailored experiences. She emphasizes that while they’ve moved away from labeling the resorts as “luxury,” Zeman’s properties continue to offer lush landscapes and a range of amenities like pickleball courts, large clubhouses, and lounges to enhance guest experiences. Ken shares the story of Wild Haven Glamping, discussing how his company provides a mid-tier glamping experience that strikes a balance between comfort and the rustic nature of camping. His properties feature canvas tents and small cabins in scenic locations like Sonoma County and Yosemite, emphasizing a natural and immersive experience over excessive luxury. Ken underscores the challenges they’ve faced, particularly in terms of permits, zoning, and construction, especially with their recent Yosemite property. Despite these hurdles, he and his team focus on delivering unique experiences that attract tourists from across the world. Leslie and Ken agree that evolving guest expectations shape their operations. Leslie notes that Zeman’s properties attract a retiree demographic who expect comfort and quality; however, the increasing demand for “luxury” resorts has redefined the standards of guest experiences, with visitors now expecting amenities akin to high-end hotels. Ken adds that Wild Haven’s guests are typically more open to a stripped-down luxury, opting for a unique natural experience over a traditionally luxurious one. They also touch on the importance of managing expectations through strategic language and marketing, emphasizing terms like “signature” instead of “luxury,” which sets an authentic tone that aligns with their guests’ values. The conversation then shifts to Airxcel, where Anthony and Paul discuss their roles in supplying RV components, such as air conditioners, water heaters, and ventilation systems, that enhance comfort for RV travelers. They explain that Airxcel has a long-standing history in Elkhart, Indiana, the “RV capital” of the U.S., providing essential products to RV manufacturers. Their focus on innovation helps the company anticipate trends, such as the rising demand for sustainable products and off-grid experiences. Paul emphasizes that Airxcel keeps a close watch on industry trends and consumer demands, aiming to deliver products that meet the evolving needs of RV enthusiasts, from full-time RVers to occasional campers. Anthony elaborates on the shift in RV ownership demographics since COVID-19, explaining how younger families and first-time RVers are increasingly investing in the lifestyle. With Airxcel’s established brands, such as Coleman air conditioners and Suburban water heaters, the company leverages its expertise to stay competitive and support new trends in the industry. Paul and Anthony both stress that consumer expectations are driving changes within the RV and camping sectors, where personalization, data-driven guest insights, and seamless technology integration are becoming essential for a superior experience. Brian also dives into potential future trends, sparking an engaging discussion on the influence of AI, automation, and personalization. The guests contemplate how new technology could transform both the outdoor hospitality and RV industries, with Brian suggesting that technology should serve to elevate the guest experience, not detract from it. Ken and Leslie agree, envisioning AI tools that could enable them to provide small, personalized touches, like welcome gifts and birthday recognition, that enhance customer satisfaction without feeling intrusive. Paul underscores the importance of AI in developing more sustainable RV solutions, citing the growing interest in systems that reduce energy use by automatically adjusting to guests’ schedules. Throughout the discussion, the guests emphasize the importance of clear expectations and strong branding. Ken and Leslie both prioritize aligning their offerings with guest expectations, ensuring that their brands promise experiences they can consistently deliver. By avoiding terms like “luxury” and “pampering” in their marketing, both Ken and Leslie are careful to set the right tone for their properties, allowing guests to feel comfortable and engaged in the outdoor experience. The episode concludes with the guests sharing where listeners can find more information about their companies and locations. Ken invites listeners to Wild Haven Glamping in Sonoma County or Yosemite to experience the beauty of Northern California. Leslie and the Airxcel team encourage interested listeners to explore Signature RV Resorts by Zeman and Airxcel’s various product offerings, respectively. The conversation wraps up on a note of optimism, with each guest expressing enthusiasm for the future of outdoor hospitality, the evolution of guest experiences, and the innovations likely to shape the industry in years to come.
July 31, 2024

MC Fireside Chats – July 31st, 2024 

In the July 31st episode of MC Fireside Chats, hosted by Brian Searl, the discussion brought together Pier Tognazzini, founder and COO of MooVert France, and Dustin Sauer, owner of Overland Van Project, to delve into the evolving trends in outdoor hospitality, sustainable tourism, and the growing van life movement. Brian Searl kicked off the episode by acknowledging the uniqueness of the discussion, as it was one of those rare “fifth-week” episodes without the usual lineup of regular guests. Instead, this episode featured a deep dive into niche areas of outdoor hospitality, beginning with Pier Tognazzini. Pier introduced MooVert France, a company dedicated to promoting tourism in France through an eco-friendly and authentic lens. He emphasized MooVert France’s commitment to helping accommodations transition into more sustainable practices by using an algorithm that evaluates properties based on their level of eco-friendliness, sustainability, and authenticity. Pier explained that MooVert is not just about reducing environmental impact but also about offering tourists an experience that goes beyond the typical attractions, allowing them to connect deeply with local culture, heritage, and nature. He provided examples of how MooVert curates these experiences, such as offering stays in tree houses, tiny homes, and even traditional French chateaux. Pier also discussed how MooVert helps property owners make small but impactful changes, such as installing water-saving devices, to enhance sustainability without compromising guest comfort. The conversation also touched on the importance of authenticity, with Pier explaining that MooVert prioritizes experiences that allow travelers to engage with local traditions and communities, such as making cheese in Normandy or harvesting honey in the Alps. Dustin Sauer then introduced Overland Van Project, which specializes in creating high-end, custom expedition vehicles and camper vans designed for those seeking adventure and luxury on the road. Dustin shared the origins of his company, which began as a personal project but quickly grew into a thriving business as demand for custom vans surged during the pandemic. He highlighted how the van life movement, amplified by social media and the hashtag #vanlife, has evolved from a niche lifestyle into a significant trend within the outdoor industry. Dustin discussed the challenges and opportunities within the current market, noting that while there has been a plateau in demand following the pandemic boom, there is still a strong interest in high-quality, custom-built vans. He emphasized the importance of innovation and craftsmanship in differentiating Overland Van Project from other builders, with a focus on integrating advanced features such as hydronic heating systems, high-end electrical setups, and luxury finishes that cater to the specific needs of their clients. Despite the market becoming saturated with both DIY and commercially produced vans, Dustin remains optimistic, citing the enduring appeal of van life and the desire for off-the-grid, self-sufficient travel experiences. The conversation between the three touched on the intersection of sustainability and the outdoor lifestyle. Dustin noted that many of his clients, despite investing in luxury vans, prefer to camp in remote, free locations like BLM lands, rather than traditional RV resorts. This aligns with the growing trend towards authentic, nature-based experiences that Pier’s company, MooVert, also champions. The guests and Brian discussed how this shift reflects broader changes in consumer behavior, where travelers are increasingly seeking out unique and meaningful experiences rather than conventional tourist activities. A significant portion of the discussion was devoted to the challenges of marketing to niche audiences in a competitive landscape dominated by large platforms like Airbnb and Booking.com. Pier and Dustin both emphasized the importance of authenticity in their marketing efforts, whether through social media engagement or creating compelling content that resonates with their target audiences. They acknowledged the difficulties small businesses face in standing out, but also highlighted the potential of social media and viral content to level the playing field. Brian also brought up the role of artificial intelligence (AI) in helping small businesses enhance their marketing strategies and reach. He expressed optimism about how AI could assist companies like MooVert France and Overland Van Project in creating more tailored and effective marketing campaigns, thereby connecting with their niche audiences more efficiently. The episode wrapped up with final thoughts from Pier and Dustin on the future of their respective industries. Pier expressed enthusiasm about the potential expansion of MooVert France into North America, hinting at ongoing discussions with state governments in Nevada and California. Dustin, on the other hand, reiterated his commitment to pushing the boundaries of van design and continuing to provide exceptional, high-quality products for his clients. Overall, this episode of MC Fireside Chats provided a rich exploration of the current trends and future directions in outdoor hospitality, with a strong emphasis on sustainability, authenticity, and the evolving desires of modern travelers. The insights shared by Pier Tognazzini and Dustin Sauer offered valuable perspectives on how businesses can adapt and thrive in this dynamic and competitive industry.